TheOcho
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Posts posted by TheOcho
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Top players in North America? Nothing personal to those kids but none of them are even the top player on their own team.
Look, we all know that some players get into camps in which they are maybe in over there head. However, the intent of the USHL is to bring in the best possible players that they can. With that said, they can't always get the players they want to attend these camps. Maybe the play other sports, have prior commitments, or simply don't want to play hockey in the summer. Was Alex Simonson the top player on his team? Probably not. But he's making an argument for himself with his play in the USHL. Look, whether you believe they should be invited to the camp or not, you should be supporting of the successes of players from your state, not making childish statements that are obviously intended to be taken in a negative manner.
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This is the most information I could find on selection, it comes directly from USHL.com: "USHL Central Scouting, like its NHL counterpart, is a league-run scouting service for the benefit of all the teams in the USHL. Throughout the 2007-08 season, the USHL Central Scouting staff of more than 20 members will identify the top players in North America. Upon identification, USHL Central Scouting will invite these elite players to participate in the USHL Central Scouting Showcase Camps, the only camps created specifically for exposure to the USHL."
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Can anyone show up to this?
The reason I ask is Bancroft was probably the 8th or 9th best player on RR last yr. Burdick may have been the 10th or 11th best player on south last yr.
I didn't know that these teams were that deep?
I have no idea what the selection process for this is like. If I find out, I'll be sure to post it.
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Possibility of Central players coming to RR. It will be an interesting year, GPR will be the team to beat though. Just hope they don't pull a RR though.
I believe Bancroft will be attending a USHL showcase tournament along with Kovaks of Dickinson, Gaustad of Grafton, Burdick of South, and Arnason of Red River as well. I may have missed a player or two in their and I apologize if that's the case.
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Alex Simonson is playing with Chicago of the USHL
Right. Sorry I missed that.
Alex Simonson-Chicago Steel
Games-9, Goals-1, Assists-0, +/- -2, PIMs- 22
He had a ten minute unsportsmanlike misconduct in the most recent game, along with 9 other players who received ten minute penalties, including abuse of officials misconduct.
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Can someone give me a list of players that played high school this year and are now playing juniors for the rest of the season?
Ryan Ladoucear- FM Jets
Games-9, Goals-0, Assists-4, +/- -6, PIMs- 2
Eric Meland- Lincoln Stars
Games-6, Goals-0, Assists-0, +/- -1, PIMs- 4
That's all that I know of.
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How many deep were you when you wrote this?
I think that is a question we all want an answer to. My guess is 13.
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11 of Red River's 12.5 championships have come since 1987, while all but 4 of Central's 23.5 came prior to 1985. So, while you are right that Central has more championships in their history than Red River, there is no denying the fact that Red River has enjoyed a great deal more success than Central for the better part of the last two decades plus. During that time period Central has been settled firmly into the 2nd tier alongside Grafton-PR and Fargo South while Red River has been in a league of their own. I think Fargo South considers Red River to be their top rival over Fargo North.
While Red River has been very good, I think it's a stretch to say they are in a league of their own. If my memory serves me correctly it was Central who was the favorite to win state during the Matt Moreland and Jordan Mcintyre era, overlapping with that was the Paul Weisgarber era at Fargo South in which they were the favorite. Although I believe Red River upset Fargo South one of those years at state I don't think it's fair to catagorize Red River as being head and shoulders above these teams they struggled to beat.
Rivalries are a tough thing to judge and ultimately it comes down the strength of the team for every given year. For example if North were to be the top team in the state I don't think anyone would doubt that their top rival would again be Fargo South. Or if a period of 5 years came where Red River was struggeling the tension between them and Central would diminish for that period of time. But when both teams are on an equal talent level there is almost no doubt they will be eachothers top rival.
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Made the front page of the sports section in the Fargo Fool'em...
It wasn't in the Star Tribune...
I'm not sure who made the statement about Red River being the Gophers of High School hockey but we need to remember that Central has far more championships than that of Red River. I think an argument can be made for many teams as the most hated team in the state. I highly doubt that the players in Dickinson hate Red River players anymore than they do those in their own conference. The same can be said for the Bismarck schools, Fargo South who's largest rival is Fargo North regardless of how terrible North has been lately. As a matter of fact many players throughout the whole state may hate South because of the stigma they have been given as being "cake eaters." Another external factor could be other sports the players participate in. While Red River may be a powerhouse at the time in hockey, their football team may not be up to par. So a player who plays in both of these sports may have a neutral vision of the school as a whole. It really isn't as cut and dry as the best teams in the state are the most hated.
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You obviously have been living under a rock the past couple of weeks. Three Red River students broke into Grafton High School and attempted to steal the state championship trophy. They were caught on security cameras but haven't faced charges yet. None of the hockey players were present.
Thanks for the info. When did the event occur? I'm terribly sorry I don't live in Grand Forks and attempted trophy thefts don't make the front page of the paper.
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Matt Malm? Haha, who cares who it is. News tonight said something about some Red River students attempting to steal the first place trophy from Grafton. Can anyone elaborate? I hope it wasn't any players.
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Pretty sure that he means they are both tendered by the Jets for next season if there is one.
Ryan Ladoucear with an assist tonight in a 5-3 win over Bismarck.
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I think i was misunderstood on the "judgement" portion of it. What i meant is that a hook, slash, trip, etc, is up to the referees discretion pending the severity of it. On too many men, it either is, or it isnt. In no way did i call Grafton cheaters. Obviously their coach would not intentionally put a player out there. And you are exactly right about having six players on the ice during a line change, but not six players in below the blue line, and the sixth man scoring the goal. And yes, Grafton did out play them the final three periods. Had thata call been made, would there be three more periods? We'll never know, but note that Grafton did not score again in regulation.
I see exactly what you're saying, and I can't say for certain I wouldn't make the same argument if I were in your shoes. Luckily, I am not, so I can see the situation in a different light. The point is that a call was missed. Calls get missed every day, in nearly every game. Like I said, it is unfortunate that the game has been tainted with this one missed call. However, what's done is done, and there is no changing it. Both teams earned the right to play in the championship game and whether or not there were six skaters on the ice Grafton may have scored that goal. Will we ever know for? Nope. That said, it is not worth diminishing the championship efforts of both teams by claiming that one missed call determined the outcome of the game. Because in reality, it did not.
On the sixth skater: The sixth skater could have been someone other than the player who scored the goal. It is possible that a player who was supposed to leave the ice, did not. I had planned on going further in depth into this aspect of the non-call but I think it is best that we quit focusing on the penalties that were not called, and focus a little more on the quality game that was played.
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MSP Jim, quite frankly, you are not very logical. The 2006 Grafton incident is totally different. Could of it been a penalty? Depends on the ref. If you watch the replay, yes, Eric Meland was on top of the goalie...how did he get ther? He was pushed by Andy Peterson. 2007, Mohagen is infamous for stick work, hooking, slashing, trip, etc. It was a penalty that was a judgement call. The Red River call was totally different. Too many men on the ice is not a judgement call, it is concrete. there are six men on the ice, no argument. Yes, you are right, refs mess up all the time, but not mistakes like that in the STATE CHAMPIONSHIP.
Also, what have the players and coaches done that has not been "bad conduct".
Final topic. You tell me "grow up." Just before that you said you would slap the stupidity out of my blonde head. I happen to have brown hair and it appears you have the growing up to do.
The analogy that six skaters on the ice is not a "judgement" call is based on flawed logic. One would assume that because there are six skaters on the ice that a penalty should be called, correct? Well, during nearly every line change that does not happen during the stoppage of play six players are on the ice at one point or another. I believe it would be an accurate assesment that the ref must use his "judgement" on whether or not the opposing team was, in fact, in violation of the rules of the game. I have seen the play, and it is obvious there are too many skaters on the ice. However, there have been plenty of times when an obvious trip, hook, or slash has occured, gone uncalled and a goal is scored. Unfortunate? Yes. Is it worth a public display of disrespect for not only Grafton, who, in the final three periods of play earned a state championship, but also that of Red River who would probably rather be remembered as an exceptional hockey team rather than the team that was allegedly "ripped" of a state championship? Not in the least.
Let it go. Grafton did not cheat. They were on a powerplay in the first place, and any coach in there right mind is not about to jepordize an excellent scoring opportunity by putting his team at risk for a penalty. A frequent and unfortunate error was made that may or may not have affected the outcome of the game. Like many other calls that affect the outcomes of games, we can't change this, and harrasing Grafton and it's players is not going to get you anywhere. That's it.
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Meaning what? They are going to play there in the future? Or right now? Thanks.
Yes, can we get some clarification. As of right now the only name I see on the roster from the bunch is Ryan Ladoucer (sp).
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Im pretty sure thr wasnt a place for GPR fans to whine and if thr was it was more seclusive back than and MUCH less people had access to computers like they do today. Im sure radio stations were flooded than too. Just like they were a few days ago. If OLD GOOCH is actually old maybe that fart can tell us how it was.
RED RIVER LOST AND THE WORLD KEEPS TURNING I am a student at Red River and thr is no spoiled brats complaing like you think. Yes thrs talk....People do that. It was a HUGE UPSET. Any Grafton fans that thought they could win it this year your either a Liar or a Joke. Red River was "The Team" this year. And to Grafton PLAYERS they were "the team to beat" and once again hats off they did it, twice. They were better team those nights. The title couldve went either way. Both teams deserved it and Grafton got it.
To be perfectly honest, the dialogue on this message board has became absolutly absurd. If you were to keep a running score on the entire year it would have been 9-7 in favor of Red River. To say that Grafton should not have believed they had a shot at the title would completely contradict the scores they posted in the regular season. Three of the four games these two teams played ended as one goal games. Plain and simple; either team could have won the state championship, and it is foolish to argue otherwise.
On the non-call: We see players slashed, hooked, held, cross checked, and interfered with every game; many times this goes uncalled. In some situations, the occurance of these infractions lead to goals. However, no one can be sure if these goals would not have occured without the infraction. It is a true injustice to the players to diminish their efforts by tainting this game over a missed call. Red River had equal opportunity to score in the final minutes of the third period and the following overtime periods. It stings to think about what might have been had the call been made, but if you lived your sporting careers that way you could go through nearly every close game you've ever played and analyzed calls you believe refs should or should not have made, and how that would have impacted the outcome. It's not going to get you anywhere. It's done, it's over with, let's move on.
Congratulations to both teams on a well played season.
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No, I'm one of those parents who played the game in high school and coached the game for almost 20 years, at the high school as well as the college level, and I can tell you that my players were never allowed to treat their opponents in a disrespectful manner w/out serious consequences. The arguement that kids "don't want to be told what to do" is the stupidest thing read on this sight in a long time. Guess what, they're kids and they'll be told what do for many more years. Hell, I'm 40 something and I still get told what to do by my superiors and cohorts on a daily basis. Let me know the role in life that exists where we are never told what to do. I'd like to meet that person.
The point was, that kids do not want to be told what to do. They will not be "kids" for many more years as when they turn 18 they will be a legal adult. At some point in time during that change to adulthood, the kids mature into adults and realize that they are going to have to listen to their superiors at their job or wherever they take their careers. For some kids, this may come before they turn 18. However, that's not really important.
Hockey is a fast paced game that is filled emotion, and spur of the moment decisions. Players are going to celebrate, and not everyone is going to be pleased with the celebration all the time. As far as I'm concerned, unless the player makes a habit of overzelous celebrations, I'm not about to hand out "serious consequences" for one instance in which his or her emotions may have ran too high.
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I don't think anyone will disagree a call was missed that could have potentially changed the outcome of the game. Is this the first time this has happend? Not even close. I've seen Red River players kick pucks in, South players cover pucks in the crease, Grafton players score with too many men, seen teams receive extra downs, etc. However, in many instances, we can not say with complete certainty had the correct call been made a goal would not have been scored, or the outcome of the game changed.
From my analysis of the video, it is my conclusion that the forward number twelve does appear to be the sixth man on the ice. However, there is no rule on how many forwards or how many defensmen a team must have on the ice at one time (just a maximum of five skaters). With that said, had Coach Haugland caught the fact that number twelve wrongly entered the game, he could have shouted out to the defensemen who was sluggishly following the play and the game would have remained 5 on 4 rather than 6 on 4, and the goal would have still occured.
Calls get missed in games, and it's really unfortunate when they taint the efforts of two very deserving teams. I think it's important to take this for what it is (a common mistake on the end of the referee) and find a way to prevent such instances from occuring in the future.
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I have no horse in this race. I am neither from or rooted for either team. I loved that it was a great game played spiritedly by two quality opponents. I was at the game with my wife and did not notice the too many men on the ice infraction. We were aware something was wrong when the officials huddled for an extended period following the goal.
It is unfortunate that the officials missed the too many men on the ice infraction. As a HS official (in football and baseball) I can say we try to get every call correct, but we do miss things. I feel for the officials, it is a terrible error, but if none of the three of them saw the six men, they cannot go back and make such a call without being sure.
Let me pose some other questions. Ones that relates to the ethics of coaching, teaching or mentoring our young adults in sports, school and life and how that relates to the rest of their lives and how they then live those lives based on what they learn from their coaches, parents and other adults who influence them.
I do not know what the GPR players and coaches knew, but nobody seems to be asking this, so I will. With all the time that passed before the puck was finally dropped after the goal, at any time did the GPR coaching staff know or become aware they had scored with 6 men on the ice? And, if they did, why did they not bring that to the attention of the game officials themselves? I ask because I believe honorable people would have. This is not the same as whether someone committed a trip or an interference, where I would never expect a coach to intervene, as those are purely judgment calls. This is an instance where supervising adults, if they knew, could have corrected an obvious injustice and not have tainted the outcome. I believe if they knew and said nothing, it is sending a very poor message to our young people about the ethics of life. If they did not know, fine, we all just have to live with the officials' error, it happened, it's over, we move on. Everyone is putting this on the game officials, but there are other possibilities here that should not be overlooked.
SportsDoc, I think we would all love to live in a world where people were so honest. But to be frank, we do not. Even so, when would a coaches authority end? Could he tell the "truth" about the opposing teams goals or penalties? I think we give the referees these responsibilities for a reason, and unfortunatly the system is not perfect. We have all seen goals kicked in, extra downs, pucks that have or have not crossed the line, etc. and the wrong call is made. I think it would be best if we enforced a greater and more effective replay system so that the most accurate call could be made everytime.
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NAHL
Marc Mihulka FM Jets (GF Red River) 43 points (14 goals/29 assists) 45 games
Marc Harrie FM Jets (Fargo Shanley) 31 points (15 goals/16 assists) 46 games
Matt Carlson Alaska Fairbanks (GF Central) 22 points (3 goals/19 assists) 43 games
Tyler Jundt North Iowa (Williston) 17 points (7 G/ 10A) 44 games
Erick Galt FM Jets (Fargo South) 17 points (3G/ 14A) 27 games
Eric Herbel Bismarck (Bottineau) 13 points (5G/ 8A) 39 games
Andy Dittus FM Jets (Minot) 11 points (6G/ 5A) 23 games
Tyler Klein FM Jets (Fargo North) 11 points (6G/ 5A) 27 games
Will Aide Bismarck (Bismarck) 8 points (3G/ 5A) 31 games
Tyler Swanson FM Jets (West Fargo) 6 points (3G/ 3A) 36 games
Alex Olson Bismarck (Devils Lake) 6 points (2G/ 4A) 27 games
Zach Miller Fairbanks/Bismarck (Grafton) 4 points (1G/ 3A) 29 games
Goalies---Elliot Okland FM Jets (Fargo North)
Mike Hillman Bismarck (Bismarck)
USHL
Jordan Willert Tri City (Minot) 28 points (19G/ 9A) 49 games
Mario Lamoureux Tri City (GF Central) 27 points (6G/ 21A) 45 games
Paul Weisgarber Waterloo (Fargo South) 20 points (5G/ 15A) 44 games
Rody Selk Des Moines (Minot) 17 points (6G/ 11A) 45 games
There may be more, but those are the ND kids that I am aware of. Eric Melland of GF Red River will be joining Lincoln at the end of this season, Alex Simonson of Red River will be in Chicago, and Ryan Ladoucer of Red River will be with the FM Jets.
Alex Simonson to Chicago? Interesting, I would have thought that after having a mediocre season (at least by his standards) that they would have lost interest. Good for him though.
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I know someone mentioned a defensive defenseman never winning the award, and while I can't think of one who won either, I can think of one who was very deserving and from the sounds of it plays a similiar game to Mr. Rehak. The kid was Sean Hoffman and he played defense for Fargo North in the 1990's. The kid was a real bruiser, and went on to play for the University of Minnesota as a linebacker (rightfully so). Anyway, with the way the voting goes, it is very possible that Ladoucer (sp?) and Meland will split votes from eastern coaches and western coaches will all vote for the same guy. Who knows. If I had to pick today with the information provided I'd probably give the nod to Meland. Mainly because I believe him and Ladouceur are on similiar tiers, but I have heard nothing about Ladouceurs intellectual level. However, it has been advertised that Meland boasts a 4.0. To be honest, I'd like to see academic ability removed from bias as to who wins the award, but the state add an all-academic team. That way the best hockey player wins the award and we still give recognition for the work the kids do that will almost certainly be of greater importance than their success on the ice. Just my take.
Chicago Showcase
in Non-collegiate sports
Posted
I also believe Team North Dakota was playing in the "B" bracket rather than the usual "A".