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UND @ James Madison Sunday May 2nd 5:00 PM Central Quarterfinals


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1 minute ago, FlinFlan80 said:

UND's WR > NDSU's WR.

 

Your answer: But Christian Watson blah blah blah. You can tell the kid is a cancer to the team culture and I'll quote this response when he enters the portal.

I'll still with our "slow" WR's.  

You can’t take Watson out of the conversation when comparing the teams, what kind of argument is that?

His talent and speed is game changing. Not good enough IMO for the next level, but he’s head and shoulders above any of UNDs guys specifically as an over the top threat.

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9 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

You can’t take Watson out of the conversation when comparing the teams, what kind of argument is that?

His talent and speed is game changing. Not good enough IMO for the next level, but he’s head and shoulders above any of UNDs guys specifically as an over the top threat.

I'm not taking him out of the conversation I just knew that you would mention him instantly. Throw him in there and I'll still take UND's group over NDSU's. MooU wanted Richter, he choose UND. Maeg would start for NDSU and steal targets from your boy. Didn't even mention Belquist, who as I stated earlier, was able to burn the dude that your squad thinks was the best DB in the FCS......

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9 minutes ago, FlinFlan80 said:

I'm not taking him out of the conversation I just knew that you would mention him instantly. Throw him in there and I'll still take UND's group over NDSU's. MooU wanted Richter, he choose UND. Maeg would start for NDSU and steal targets from your boy. Didn't even mention Belquist, who as I stated earlier, was able to burn the dude that your squad thinks was the best DB in the FCS......

Of course I would mention him, he’s by far our best and fastest receiver.

Your argument makes no sense in the context of our conversation because Watson specifically provides the speed and over the top game that UND doesn’t have and is the entire point of this discussion. 

You have some solid guys, I’d be the first to admit it. A couple of guys I would tak in Fargo in a heartbeat. I would love to have Belquist in green and gold, his dad and uncle were excellent receivers and are even better men.

But neither Belquist nor anyone else on your roster is an over the top, scare a defense to go into a different coverage player, Watson is.

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6 hours ago, Bison06 said:

You can’t take Watson out of the conversation when comparing the teams, what kind of argument is that?

His talent and speed is game changing. Not good enough IMO for the next level, but he’s head and shoulders above any of UNDs guys specifically as an over the top threat.

He’s faster than UND’s guys, but I wouldn’t agree he is head and shoulders better as a WR. I will take UND’s receivers. They are athletic, catch in a crowd, and they block well. Considering how often his speed made a difference ( I know it can) this year, I will take the complete package guy every time. Your speed guys needs the QB to get him the deep ball. That requires protection for the QB and receiver to beat the DB of find the seam in the zone. I think it’s tougher than the 8-15 yd pass plays that take less time but require better timing to get ball to receivers on the break. The fastest WR we ever had was Norm McGee. All- American sprinter in track and qualified for the Olympic trials as a sprinter I believe. He could out run any defender but QB has to adjust to elite speed and it’s surprising how often these guys are overthrown or under thrown. I’m not sure there is a right or wrong answer but just my opinion. 

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2 hours ago, iramurphy said:

He’s faster than UND’s guys, but I wouldn’t agree he is head and shoulders better as a WR. I will take UND’s receivers. They are athletic, catch in a crowd, and they block well. Considering how often his speed made a difference ( I know it can) this year, I will take the complete package guy every time. Your speed guys needs the QB to get him the deep ball. That requires protection for the QB and receiver to beat the DB of find the seam in the zone. I think it’s tougher than the 8-15 yd pass plays that take less time but require better timing to get ball to receivers on the break. The fastest WR we ever had was Norm McGee. All- American sprinter in track and qualified for the Olympic trials as a sprinter I believe. He could out run any defender but QB has to adjust to elite speed and it’s surprising how often these guys are overthrown or under thrown. I’m not sure there is a right or wrong answer but just my opinion. 

As I’ve said, UND has some nice players, I’m not diminishing their abilities. However, in the context of this conversation which started by saying UND doesn’t have a single receiving with game breaking, over the top speed. In that respect, Watson is special and is the type of player that gets highlighted in a defensive game planning session. UND didn’t have a receiver like that this year. 
 

For the record, I’m not the one who initiated the UND vs NDSU receivers conversation. I simply made a comment about UNDs lack of elite speed at the receiver position which is a well known and commonly discussed topic on this board. 

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9 hours ago, Bison06 said:

As I’ve said, UND has some nice players, I’m not diminishing their abilities. However, in the context of this conversation which started by saying UND doesn’t have a single receiving with game breaking, over the top speed. In that respect, Watson is special and is the type of player that gets highlighted in a defensive game planning session. UND didn’t have a receiver like that this year. 
 

For the record, I’m not the one who initiated the UND vs NDSU receivers conversation. I simply made a comment about UNDs lack of elite speed at the receiver position which is a well known and commonly discussed topic on this board. 

If he was so fast, why did Maeg accumulare more receiving yards? If I'm an OC with half a brain, I'm taking shots to a game changing WR all day. I wonder if Roehl knows this is how one's brain should operate?

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18 minutes ago, FlinFlan80 said:

If he was so fast, why did Maeg accumulare more receiving yards? If I'm an OC with half a brain, I'm taking shots to a game changing WR all day. I wonder if Roehl knows this is how one's brain should operate?

I think your post answers your own question.

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2 hours ago, FlinFlan80 said:

If he was so fast, why did Maeg accumulare more receiving yards? If I'm an OC with half a brain, I'm taking shots to a game changing WR all day. I wonder if Roehl knows this is how one's brain should operate?

I’m sure we could go back and forth for days on this. I have no interest in debating whether or not Christian Watson has elite speed with you. Does that make him the best wide receiver in a discussion? No. Speed is one attribute that is desirable in a player. I would argue for a receiver it’s not even the most important one.


But, for the millionth time, in the context of this conversation about UND not having a deep ball threat, a player like Watson is exactly what UND is missing. I don’t think I can say it more clearly than that.

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41 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

I’m sure we could go back and forth for days on this. I have no interest in debating whether or not Christian Watson has elite speed with you. Does that make him the best wide receiver in a discussion? No. Speed is one attribute that is desirable in a player. I would argue for a receiver it’s not even the most important one.


But, for the millionth time, in the context of this conversation about UND not having a deep ball threat, a player like Watson is exactly what UND is missing. I don’t think I can say it more clearly than that.

Fully agree!

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4 hours ago, zonadub said:

Don’t remember Fred Biletnikoff (old Oakland Raiders) or Jordy Nelson (Packers) being particularly fast, but they could get separated and they had great hands.

Freddie 4.7. Jordy 4.51. 

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8 hours ago, Bison06 said:

I’m sure we could go back and forth for days on this. I have no interest in debating whether or not Christian Watson has elite speed with you. Does that make him the best wide receiver in a discussion? No. Speed is one attribute that is desirable in a player. I would argue for a receiver it’s not even the most important one.


But, for the millionth time, in the context of this conversation about UND not having a deep ball threat, a player like Watson is exactly what UND is missing. I don’t think I can say it more clearly than that.

My comments really aren’t so much about Watson. Your points are well taken. Too many on this board are enamored by “elite” speed. 4.6 forty speed is good. There are not many forty yard passes in a game. A big receiver who can read a defense and find the seem and catch the ball is an excellent receiver. If the can run a 4.3 or 4.4 forty and do those things that’s even better. Those are the guys who get drafted. 

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18 minutes ago, iramurphy said:

My comments really aren’t so much about Watson. Your points are well taken. Too many on this board are enamored by “elite” speed. 4.6 forty speed is good. There are not many forty yard passes in a game. A big receiver who can read a defense and find the seem and catch the ball is an excellent receiver. If the can run a 4.3 or 4.4 forty and do those things that’s even better. Those are the guys who get drafted. 

Absolutely, I agree.

But...I can tell you from personal experience, lining up against a guy who runs 10.2-10.3 puts a fear in your heart as a corner that you do not have when lining up against 10.8. That corner is taking a half step or full step back at the snap and the safety is shading that side thinking about that deep ball every single snap.
 

Having both types of guys on your offense keeps defensive backfield on their toes and slower to show up in run game support.
 


 

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3 minutes ago, Bison06 said:

Absolutely, I agree.

But...I can tell you from personal experience, lining up against a guy who runs 10.2-10.3 puts a fear in your heart as a corner that you do not have when lining up against 10.8. That corner is taking a half step or full step back at the snap and the safety is shading that side thinking about that deep ball every single snap.
 

Having both types of guys on your offense keeps defensive backfield on their toes and slower to show up in run game support.
 


 

That’s when you give him a little bigger cushion at LOS or you better be able to knock him off his route and slow him down enough to give your teammates time to pressure the QB. The other attribute that I think is really important is quickness. Acceleration off the receivers cut and quickness to beat the DB press at LOS to create separation. 

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6 minutes ago, iramurphy said:

That’s when you give him a little bigger cushion at LOS or you better be able to knock him off his route and slow him down enough to give your teammates time to pressure the QB. The other attribute that I think is really important is quickness. Acceleration off the receivers cut and quickness to beat the DB press at LOS to create separation. 

Agreed, I always found the guys who really took pride in route running to be the most frustrating to play against. Travis White at ndsu was the epitome of this for me. Was a 4.5 guy, but he could make you look so foolish with his route running. He was so difficult to cover.

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I guess the concerns of  @bulldogg about JMU coming off the throttles when they have a lead came to fruition on Saturday: score 24 in the second, give up 28 in the third.

Come off the the gas,
Get it shoved up your a-a-a-and now we talk SDSU and SHSU ... ;) 

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