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2020 Dumpster Fire (Enter at your own risk)

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55 minutes ago, Old Fella said:

You have accuratly discribed the current administration.

You seem to have escaped the wrath of Mafia Man for some reason. 

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9 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

Such a refreshing place to come and learn about republican politics.

Stay home or die...amirite?

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Looking at MN numbers today

Another increase in cases, but not shocking due to the outbreaks in Worthington and the turkey plants in Willmar and Cold Spring.  

The promised testing has been ramping up as MN did about 4500 tests today.

Uffda.….

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This is where the numbers game gets spun:

1.  Cases are going up.  Yes, confirmed cases are going up as a result of increased testing, specifically increased testing in high risk populations.  The question to ask is whether or not the rise in positive cases is due to proliferation of virus or proliferation of testing?  

2.  deaths continue to rise.  Of course they do cumulatively, but what’s the rate of change? when was the onset of disease in the dead?  It’s a 30-45 day lagging indicator.  
 

spinning policy on either of these stats without full analysis is a joke.

how about available hospital beds to treat potential covid patients?  That number is huge.  It’s also important if indeed our shelter in place orders were to avoid a run on the healthcare system’s resources.

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American Association of Physicians and Surgeons have published their support of hydroxychloroquine to treat Covid based on evidence...6 weeks later...

I wonder why there’s been so much resistance to this drug therapy referenced by Trump at the outset of this disaster....almost as if there is some ulterior motive at play... but this is America, I mean the FBI doesn’t do things like the Gestapo or KGB does it....

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9 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

TESTING DOESN'T MATTER!!!!

For gawds sake sheep, the only thing a test can do is confirm syptoms.

Lets play the game though.

Tomorrow every person in the country is tested. Great. What does that tell us.

Who has the virus at that moment in time.

Awesome.

The day after tomorrow everyone would need to be tested again, and the next day, and the next day, and the next day.

350 Millions tests per day.

Even IF you could do that what then, forced isolation...  thats incarceration, btw ... of all that currently carry?

Ok cool, for how long, 14 days. 37 days, 45 days?... what happens then? Its out there in the world and zero people actually know where or in what or with what this thing can live. Can animals catch it, obviously yes? Are some species completely asymptomatic hosts and carriers, who know, but likely some are. So what euthanize all animals?

All of these hypotheticals are 100% not possible. 

Antibody testing to find out who has been an carrier the past 6 months is the only way to be able to provide accurate data as to the infection rates, hospitalization rates and the actual danger of this thing. 

Im sick of the data available now being used to manipulate.  

Testing is the red herring being used to distract, manipulate, scare, control, and extort.

 

Totally agree.  

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while I completely agree that testing for active cases provides zero practical value for management.  It will give the epidemiologists that have been so geeked some more data to get aroused by...

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3 hours ago, Frozen4sioux said:

TESTING DOESN'T MATTER!!!!

GATHERING INFORMATION TO HELP MAKE FUTURE DECISIONS IS A BAD IDEA!!!!

Turns out typing in all caps doesn't actually make it true.

Yes, antibody testing is going to be incredibly important, but until they are actual able to be accurate (which they currently are struggling with), gathering information on who is currently infected is one of the few things they can do to help limit the spread. Yes, it obviously measures a specific point in time, but it allows those who are positive to take proper steps and also give those they know they have been in contact with knowledge that they also need to take some precautions.

Local example: No testing means LM Glasfiber is still open and their employees didn't spend the last 2 weeks at home instead of at work and out in the community, buying groceries and other essntials. And those who had been in contact with them can't get tested to see if they are also carrying the virus, spreading it further,  instead of finding out if they need to take further precautions to stop spreading it.

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47 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

Such a refreshing place to come and learn about republican politics.

echo.....echo......echo......echo......echo......echo

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20 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

TESTING DOESN'T MATTER!!!!

For gawds sake sheep, the only thing a test can do is confirm syptoms.

Lets play the game though.

Tomorrow every person in the country is tested. Great. What does that tell us.

Who has the virus at that moment in time.

Awesome.

The day after tomorrow everyone would need to be tested again, and the next day, and the next day, and the next day.

350 Millions tests per day.

Even IF you could do that what then, forced isolation...  thats incarceration, btw ... of all that currently carry?

Ok cool, for how long, 14 days. 37 days, 45 days?... what happens then? Its out there in the world and zero people actually know where or in what or with what this thing can live. Can animals catch it, obviously yes? Are some species completely asymptomatic hosts and carriers, who know, but likely some are. So what euthanize all animals?

All of these hypotheticals are 100% not possible. 

Antibody testing to find out who has been an carrier the past 6 months is the only way to be able to provide accurate data as to the infection rates, hospitalization rates and the actual danger of this thing. 

Im sick of the data available now being used to manipulate.  

Testing is the red herring being used to distract, manipulate, scare, control, and extort.

 

Um testing does matter because if you test positive the government will order you to isolate to prevent you from sharing the virus with others. If you live in ND.....

https://www.legis.nd.gov/cencode/t23c07-6.pdf

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Do you think that asymptomatic people will act differently if they know they are positive?  I don’t think they will.  Conscientious people will continue to act conscientiously and reckless people recklessly.  So testing then would be a tool used by authorities to impose will?  God is that a slippery slope.  Especially with something biological...

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Folks this isn’t a disease from a movie that kills like Charlie Bronson on a vendetta...80%+ are asymptomatic or mild...

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ND.....40 new cases on 2065 tests today. Most tests in a single day. Less than 2% positive rate today which is half of what the rate has been to date.

4 deaths...one in 70s, 1 in 80s and 2 in 90s.

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13 minutes ago, yzerman19 said:

Do you think that asymptomatic people will act differently if they know they are positive?  I don’t think they will.  Conscientious people will continue to act conscientiously and reckless people recklessly.  So testing then would be a tool used by authorities to impose will?  God is that a slippery slope.  Especially with something biological...

I sure would hope an identified asymptomatic carrier would isolate themselves. As far as I can tell they'd be committing a class b misdemeanor in ND if they didn't. I know we can't stop people from acting recklessly but the government can and should be taking measures to limit reckless behavior. To encourage compliance I would hope the government could assist to make sure this is do-able and that person would be eligible for some paid leave from work or unemployment benefits. 

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1 hour ago, Frozen4sioux said:

TESTING DOESN'T MATTER!!!!

For gawds sake sheep, the only thing a test can do is confirm syptoms.

Lets play the game though.

Tomorrow every person in the country is tested. Great. What does that tell us.

Who has the virus at that moment in time.

Awesome.

The day after tomorrow everyone would need to be tested again, and the next day, and the next day, and the next day.

350 Millions tests per day.

Even IF you could do that what then, forced isolation...  thats incarceration, btw ... of all that currently carry?

Ok cool, for how long, 14 days. 37 days, 45 days?... what happens then? Its out there in the world and zero people actually know where or in what or with what this thing can live. Can animals catch it, obviously yes? Are some species completely asymptomatic hosts and carriers, who know, but likely some are. So what euthanize all animals?

All of these hypotheticals are 100% not possible. 

Antibody testing to find out who has been an carrier the past 6 months is the only way to be able to provide accurate data as to the infection rates, hospitalization rates and the actual danger of this thing. 

Im sick of the data available now being used to manipulate.  

Testing is the red herring being used to distract, manipulate, scare, control, and extort.

 

and don't forget to add in all the false positives and false negatives...dawhoops!

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28 minutes ago, keikla said:

I find this surprising...not that they're so far behind but that they're still supporting it.  The vast majority of hospitals here have pulled it from their treatment protocols. It is not just a concern of lack of efficacy, but a concern for poorer outcomes compared to those who don't receive the medication at all. 

The VA's experience with hydroxochlorquine was disastrous and likely resulted in the hastened death of 100's of veterans.  At this point, it's a snake oil cure but Trump pumped it up as it's manufactured by folks who support his campaign, who will likely pay him back with a campaign donation.

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2 minutes ago, dlsiouxfan said:

The VA's experience with hydroxochlorquine was disastrous and likely resulted in the hastened death of 100's of veterans.  At this point, it's a snake oil cure but Trump pumped it up as it's manufactured by folks who support his campaign, who will likely pay him back with a campaign donation.

has hydroxychloroquine saved your life? if not ask someone that feels like it did. 

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53 minutes ago, Redneksioux said:

To encourage compliance I would hope the government could assist to make sure this is do-able and that person would be eligible for some paid leave from work or unemployment benefits. 

This is already in place.

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1 hour ago, yzerman19 said:

Do you think that asymptomatic people will act differently if they know they are positive?  I don’t think they will.  Conscientious people will continue to act conscientiously and reckless people recklessly.  So testing then would be a tool used by authorities to impose will?  God is that a slippery slope.  Especially with something biological...

Testing is going to be key in getting back to normal.  Most companies are going to have a negative Covid test as a qualification for a sick employee to return to work when this opens back up.  This is a total mismatch with the reality in most states where tests are being rationed to only the most sick and those with a potential exposure.   Without testing capacity this will result in billions in lost productivity as employees sit at home without access to a test because they weren't sick enough or who had other less contagious conditions.   

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5 minutes ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

has hydroxychloroquine saved your life? if not ask someone that feels like it did. 

That would be a biased survey.  Those who it killed aren't around to tell us how they feel about it.

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