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1 hour ago, stoneySIOUX said:

Don't get me wrong, I know this team needs to score more. But, I was just bummed with the narrative that our recruiting is down despite the best d-corps pipeline in the country.

The “recruiting is down” narrative is an overreaction to how the season went. It has little to do with recruiting and more to do with the lack of development of certain players already on campus. Because of this lack of development, people are looking at future players,  failing to realize not many freshmen can make an instant impact right away like some would like. 

This is obviously just my observation of things. 

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1 hour ago, Irish said:

I agree that we have some great talent in the pipeline with the d-men.  Usually nothing is as good or as bad as the fan board paints it.  I admit to being one who has expressed frustration with our recruiting on offense.  I truly hope this idea is wrong.  Where did it come from?  First, looking at last year's team we had a marked decrease in the number of drafted players - I know, I know - Caggula,  but no one appeared to be upping his game last year.  Second, our sophomore class - with the number of early departures this group was expected to step up and fill in and for the most part was a bust.  Third, the eye test - it was tough watching us fight the puck, chip it off the glass, and not be able to hold leads (to say nothing about our power play).  The missing high-end skills were pretty visible.  I hope this narrative is only fan over-reaction,  but seeing not only Denver, but St. Cloud and Duluth pull in good talent sent a collective worry through many fans.  Remember, we are used to NHL talent playing here.  Could this be an over-reaction from me and other fans - sure.  To be honest, we've had such a good run it is hard to know what to make of the last season.  Will Berry right the ship - I really think he will.  Should we as fans hope for some more firepower - absolutely.  

Denver and UND both had 5 drafted players this past year.  Denver is losing 4 of theirs now, which is the average of the number of players we lost early to the professional ranks each of the last two off seasons. 

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1 hour ago, Irish said:

I agree that we have some great talent in the pipeline with the d-men.  Usually nothing is as good or as bad as the fan board paints it.  I admit to being one who has expressed frustration with our recruiting on offense.  I truly hope this idea is wrong.  Where did it come from?  First, looking at last year's team we had a marked decrease in the number of drafted players - I know, I know - Caggula,  but no one appeared to be upping his game last year.  Second, our sophomore class - with the number of early departures this group was expected to step up and fill in and for the most part was a bust.  Third, the eye test - it was tough watching us fight the puck, chip it off the glass, and not be able to hold leads (to say nothing about our power play).  The missing high-end skills were pretty visible.  I hope this narrative is only fan over-reaction,  but seeing not only Denver, but St. Cloud and Duluth pull in good talent sent a collective worry through many fans.  Remember, we are used to NHL talent playing here.  Could this be an over-reaction from me and other fans - sure.  To be honest, we've had such a good run it is hard to know what to make of the last season.  Will Berry right the ship - I really think he will.  Should we as fans hope for some more firepower - absolutely.  

To me, this is the absolute root of the problem and is 100% justified in driving the narrative. I truly think the coaches expected one more year out of Jost. I think he would have single handedly gotten us into the tournament and this narrative could have very well not existed. 

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46 minutes ago, siouxforce19 said:

The “recruiting is down” narrative is an overreaction to how the season went. It has little to do with recruiting and more to do with the lack of development of certain players already on campus. Because of this lack of development, people are looking at future players,  failing to realize not many freshmen can make an instant impact right away like some would like. 

This is obviously just my observation of things. 

Not that I didn't enjoy the rest of the post, but you could have stopped right there. I agree 1,000,000%

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If people want to stress over recruiting, it’s fine. Offseason has been real boring and we all need to pass the time somehow. 

I think next year’s team will be more skilled than last year’s. 

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5 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Agree. 

I’m still bitter about it. (And I think a lot of people are based on conversations in the stands at REA this past season.)

Is that bad? 

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I'm down on Jost bolting but, He seems to be developing quite well with this group in Colorado, He is making an impact at times, in the Stanley Cup playoffs.  

Probably was best for him to work it out and grow with this group in the NHL this year.

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20 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Probably was best for him to work it out and grow with this group in the NHL this year.

Blasphemy! Heathen! 

:D 

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1 hour ago, siouxforce19 said:

The “recruiting is down” narrative is an overreaction to how the season went. It has little to do with recruiting and more to do with the lack of development of certain players already on campus. Because of this lack of development, people are looking at future players,  failing to realize not many freshmen can make an instant impact right away like some would like. 

This is obviously just my observation of things. 

I’m not so sure on that.  Recruiting has been down a bit in the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 5-10 years, especially as it relates to high end recruits.  We are starting to lose potential commits that we would have rarely lost during the early 2000s.  That’s Hockey though, it’s cyclical. Other schools are building their programs and have great facilities (and campus life) too.  Also, recruiting has gotten tougher now as bigger program have to recruit younger and younger players.  There’s more room to miss with those young players.  Schools like the gophs and Michigan can afford to miss more often than us as they have hockey hotbeds in their backyards.

all in all, we have a nice defensive group coming in (knock on wood :) ).

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11 minutes ago, scpa0305 said:

I’m not so sure on that.  Recruiting has been down a bit in the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 5-10 years, especially as it relates to high end recruits.  We are starting to lose potential commits that we would have rarely lost during the early 2000s.  That’s Hockey though, it’s cyclical. Other schools are building their programs and have great facilities (and campus life) too.  Also, recruiting has gotten tougher now as bigger program have to recruit younger and younger players.  There’s more room to miss with those young players.  Schools like the gophs and Michigan can afford to miss more often than us as they have hockey hotbeds in their backyards.

all in all, we have a nice defensive group coming in (knock on wood :) ).

 Do you have some inside knowledge? 

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2 hours ago, scpa0305 said:

Schools like the gophs and Michigan can afford to miss more often than us as they have hockey hotbeds in their backyards.

They can???  What have they done over the last 5 - 10 years with their hockey hotbed recruits?

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3 hours ago, scpa0305 said:

I’m not so sure on that.  Recruiting has been down a bit in the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 5-10 years, especially as it relates to high end recruits.  We are starting to lose potential commits that we would have rarely lost during the early 2000s.  That’s Hockey though, it’s cyclical. Other schools are building their programs and have great facilities (and campus life) too.  Also, recruiting has gotten tougher now as bigger program have to recruit younger and younger players.  There’s more room to miss with those young players.  Schools like the gophs and Michigan can afford to miss more often than us as they have hockey hotbeds in their backyards.

all in all, we have a nice defensive group coming in (knock on wood :) ).

This sentence makes UND sound like a freaking mid-major program. :angry:

I can accept being a mid-major in basketball, but I will never accept being a mid-major in hockey. Ever. 

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3 hours ago, scpa0305 said:

I’m not so sure on that.  Recruiting has been down a bit in the past 4-5 years as compared to the previous 5-10 years, especially as it relates to high end recruits.  

My $.02, I think they've only had one class that I'd consider a miss (will be Junior class). What's hurt UND the past couple years is the outrageous number of players that have left early and signed NHL contracts. Outside of I believe BC & BU, they've pretty much doubled that of any other school. It's tough when you have large freshman classes year after year. When you're talking talent, having that many players (outside of Thompson / Johnson), that all made it to the show to in different extents I'd argue says the exact opposite that recruiting is down. 

Last years freshman class was widely regarded as Top 5, the '19 & '20 classes are loaded as well. I'll just toss out a name like Luke Reid, who played regularly for Penticton as a Sophomore in HS, was a 2nd round WHL pick. He doesn't get a lot of run right now as far as hype, but will be a big time player once he arrives on campus. The '01's and '02's UND has in the pipeline right now are incredibly talented. 

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30 minutes ago, fightingsioux4life said:

This sentence makes UND sound like a freaking mid-major program. :angry:

I can accept being a mid-major in basketball, but I will never accept being a mid-major in hockey. Ever. 

 

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Things can change obviously, but I don't think I'd trade UND's current 02's (Kleven, Bowen, Kunz, Sanderson) for any other schools Top 4 for that years birth year. 

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36 minutes ago, AJS said:

My $.02, I think they've only had one class that I'd consider a miss (will be Junior class). What's hurt UND the past couple years is the outrageous number of players that have left early and signed NHL contracts. Outside of I believe BC & BU, they've pretty much doubled that of any other school. It's tough when you have large freshman classes year after year. When you're talking talent, having that many players (outside of Thompson / Johnson), that all made it to the show to in different extents I'd argue says the exact opposite that recruiting is down. 

Last years freshman class was widely regarded as Top 5, the '19 & '20 classes are loaded as well. I'll just toss out a name like Luke Reid, who played regularly for Penticton as a Sophomore in HS, was a 2nd round WHL pick. He doesn't get a lot of run right now as far as hype, but will be a big time player once he arrives on campus. The '01's and '02's UND has in the pipeline right now are incredibly talented. 

I like that you brought up Luke Reid. He’s one of a bunch of recruits that rarely (if ever) are discussed on this board. 

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2 hours ago, Rick said:

They can???  What have they done over the last 5 - 10 years with their hockey hotbed recruits?

MN has won a bunch of conference champioships.  Michigan recruits too young...they haven’t had a nice blend of blue chippers and good depth players.  Michigan does pull nice blue chippers with the best of hem though, similar to how we used to.

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On 12/13/2017 at 7:55 PM, siouxforcefans said:

He'll back back with the Force in the spring, so will get back to that competition. Looking forward to it!

This is most of the story. And sad. Hak told me "best hands I've seen for a 16 yo" when he committed, then Marks took over and told him to toughen up, and the rest is history...

 

On 12/13/2017 at 8:04 PM, scpa0305 said:

Cakebread?  The kid with a hatty game one in the ushl (as a 16 year old) and never did anything again?  I’m curious on your comparison.

Another drop on the roller coaster called Cakebread’s hockey career: 

http://www.niagara-gazette.com/sports/lammers-cuts-eight-from-niagara-hockey/article_5e7ac4a8-9ec2-5db9-ae62-a1cdcafae811.html

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14 hours ago, fightingsioux4life said:

This sentence makes UND sound like a freaking mid-major program. :angry:

I can accept being a mid-major in basketball, but I will never accept being a mid-major in hockey. Ever. 

haha.  Und typically pulls blue chippers but they back fill with higher end over agers. Similar to teams like Denver.  Mn and mich always have very young teams because they rely on very young players.  All in all, i like our strategy, I just think we’ve been missing on more higher end players than in years plast.  The players we do get and are very saught after recruits, I’ve always said that when they get bashed on this board.  Again, I’m focused on the high end kids with my comments.

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10 hours ago, scpa0305 said:

haha.  Und typically pulls blue chippers but they back fill with higher end over agers. Similar to teams like Denver.  Mn and mich always have very young teams because they rely on very young players.  All in all, i like our strategy, I just think we’ve been missing on more higher end players than in years plays.  The players we do get and all very saught after recruits, I’ve alwats said that when they get bashed on this board.  Again, I’m focused on the high end kids.

I might be wrong, but I thought we were very close to the goofs for average age, at least last year. I think Mich was one of the youngest in the country.

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Hain had 3 shots and a minor penalty and was +2 today in USA 8-5 SUI at the U-18.

USA jumped out 3-0 just 5 minutes into the game but was trailing 5-4 late in the second. 

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32 minutes ago, UNDMOORHEAD said:

I might be wrong, but I thought we were very close to the goofs for average age, at least last year. I think Mich was one of the youngest in the country.

Yes, that's right.  Even back in the 90's, when their fans would use the excuse about older players, it was very close.  Some years we'd be older by just a little and other years they'd be older by just a little.

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1 hour ago, UNDMOORHEAD said:

I might be wrong, but I thought we were very close to the goofs for average age, at least last year. I think Mich was one of the youngest in the country.

Maybe last year.  You could be right. In the past 3-4 years MN actually has picked up some over age kids.  That is new development however.  They have been notorious for having very young teams.  A few years ago we had a one of the younger teams in the country too.  It all depends how many “true” players you have.  Lately we’ve had quite a few over agers.

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