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BTHC - Alvarez and OSU want to make it happen?


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With regards to revenue, a lot depends on how much hockey adds to the cable Big Ten Network. Cable networks are charged for the right show the BTN at like a $1 a month per subscriber. For instance, if hockey is added and the BTN gains 1 million homes as a direct result, that's an additional $12 million flowing anuually to the Big Ten. Cable companies resisted the BTN because of the fee: but they finally gave in to the Big Ten commissioner Delaney. If even 250,000 homes were added to the BTN because of hockey, Delaney would likely want a BTHC.

Delaney is considered one of the most powerful men in sports. If he wants a BTHC (and all indications are that he does), he has the power to alter Maturi's and Minnesota's opinion.

Why would they gain a million/250,000 subs if hockey is added? Haven't they already saturated the cable systems in the B10 viewing area?

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Why would they gain a million/250,000 subs if hockey is added? Haven't they already saturated the cable systems in the B10 viewing area?

They are on crack if they think college hockey will add that kind of subs. Fan bases in college hockey are VERY loyal, but very small. Maturi is looking out for the Gophers best interests and nobody else. The UMD/MSU/SCSU games are typically every bit as fun as when we play the Mich schools. BSU will likely fit right in as well.

CC and DU games are typically fun as well and of course UND games are the best. Surprisingly UW games after Eaves has taken over just don't do much for me.

If there HAS to be a BTHC, I'd hope they go with five, exclude ND and trust PWR to get their teams in. If ND wants to be part of the BT, then they need to get in every sport.

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Delaney is considered one of the most powerful men in sports. If he wants a BTHC (and all indications are that he does), he has the power to alter Maturi's and Minnesota's opinion.

Delaney may be "powerful", but the SEC, Pac10 and Big12 are usually eating his conference's lunch in the Bowls and alot of other non-conference play. Maybe the pressure of failing to bring home a national title in the bigger sports recently is gettting to him.

I still don't see the non-hockey playing B10 schools like IU, Purdue or Northwestern really caring about hockey, let alone allowing an effectively "dilution" of the B10 by allowing smaller hockey schools in. I hate to break it to Mr. Delaney, but the BTN was/is a helluva gamble from the start, and contriving "rivalries" between the hockey schools and some also-rans from other non-B10 conferences will never change that. And for the record, I wouldn't support a BTHC even if UND was part of the package.

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Why would they gain a million/250,000 subs if hockey is added? Haven't they already saturated the cable systems in the B10 viewing area?

The cable systems in the B10 viewing area are probably saturated: it's the cable systems beyond the eight states of the Big Ten that aren't. Adding just a tiny fraction of those because of hockey interest is big $'s. But it's not only about subscribers, but about ratings and commerical rates and penetration of the Big Ten label. Delaney almost certainly doesn't like Big Ten schools playing a money-generating sport in non-Big Ten conferences.

Delaney may be "powerful", but the SEC, Pac10 and Big12 are usually eating his conference's lunch in the Bowls and alot of other non-conference play. Maybe the pressure of failing to bring home a national title in the bigger sports recently is gettting to him.

I still don't see the non-hockey playing B10 schools like IU, Purdue or Northwestern really caring about hockey, let alone allowing an effectively "dilution" of the B10 by allowing smaller hockey schools in. I hate to break it to Mr. Delaney, but the BTN was/is a helluva gamble from the start, and contriving "rivalries" between the hockey schools and some also-rans from other non-B10 conferences will never change that. And for the record, I wouldn't support a BTHC even if UND was part of the package.

Delaney has also almost singlehandedly prevented a true FBS tournament championship, in large part to protect the Rose Bowl, but also so Big Ten football won't be exposed for being as weak as it is.

Agree that the Big Ten Network was a huge gamble, but it's paying huge dividends. The threat of its own network prompted the SEC to get huge increases in TV dollars. The Big 12 is looking at its own network, largely because of how successful the Big Ten was.

IMHO, Delaney would gladly sacrifice hockey history for contrived rivalries if it meant $'s. The Big Ten has used the MAC schools in football (the two conferences have a scheduling agreement), why not in hockey?

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Unless the Big Ten Network is ready to pony up some big dollars to these schools it doesn't make sense financially. Heck Notre Dame's arena only holds 2667 fans. With Omaha coming in next year you now have the 4 largest arenas in the country in the WCHA and those four are almost sold out every game. If they have a brain in ther head they will wait to see if some programs fold and then realign like they did when Michigan, Michigan State, and Notre Dame left the WCHA many years ago to form the CCHA.

With 10 WCHA teams we currently play 18 conference games and 8 non-conference games. In the Big Ten league if there were only 6 teams they would play 10 conference games and be looking for 18 non-conference games. So the idea of reginalization sounds good but unless Wisconsin plays all of the Michigan teams and Minnesota plays all of the Minnesota teams for non-conference games, regionalization is thrown out the window.

If a Big Ten hockey conference started up the WCHA would survive with 10 teams and the competition would be just as strong as it is now. The thing we'd all miss would be the rivalry we have generated with both schools.

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The thing we'd all miss would be the rivalry we have generated with both schools.

Wisconsin doesn't do anything for me, I'd rather play DU. I'm not sure why people say Wisco is a huge rival? to me it was a heated rivalry created over a water bottle incident 27 years ago but hasn't had much luster since.

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With 10 WCHA teams we currently play 18 conference games and 8 non-conference games. In the Big Ten league if there were only 6 teams they would play 10 conference games and be looking for 18 non-conference games. So the idea of reginalization sounds good but unless Wisconsin plays all of the Michigan teams and Minnesota plays all of the Minnesota teams for non-conference games, regionalization is thrown out the window.

Good point. Even though it looks like the power is with the BT, this will negatively affect college hockey as a whole. Is it possible that if all of the other schools banded together and did not schedule non conference games against the BTHC teams, that they could force the demise of this dumb idea. Or would enough of the smaller teams cross over for the lure of higher gate revenues?

If a Big Ten hockey conference started up the WCHA would survive with 10 teams and the competition would be just as strong as it is now. The thing we'd all miss would be the rivalry we have generated with both schools.

I don't think that we can assume the WCHA would be at 10 teams. I think Michigan Tech might take a look at the new, weakened CCHA, and then take a look at the new WCHA, minus 2 of its biggest programs. The lure of easier competition combined with lower gates from not having UM and UW on the schedule might be enough to get them to switch. I don't think the fact the DU and UND still would be in the league would be a huge selling point for them to stay, although you could argue that with the WCHA weakened as well, they might as well just stay anyways. Just a thought.

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With 10 WCHA teams we currently play 28 conference games and 6-8 non-conference games. In the Big Ten league if there were only 6 teams they would play 10 conference games and be looking for 18 non-conference games. So the idea of reginalization sounds good but unless Wisconsin plays all of the Michigan teams and Minnesota plays all of the Minnesota teams for non-conference games, regionalization is thrown out the window.

Fixed your post.

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Unless the Big Ten Network is ready to pony up some big dollars to these schools it doesn't make sense financially. Heck Notre Dame's arena only holds 2667 fans.

Their new arena that is currently being built is going to hold 5000+

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Wisconsin doesn't do anything for me, I'd rather play DU. I'm not sure why people say Wisco is a huge rival? to me it was a heated rivalry created over a water bottle incident 27 years ago but hasn't had much luster since.

It was a big deal to play them when they were good.

Now that they've been an average team lately, not so much.

Of course those things will come and go.

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Good point. Even though it looks like the power is with the BT, this will negatively affect college hockey as a whole. Is it possible that if all of the other schools banded together and did not schedule non conference games against the BTHC teams, that they could force the demise of this dumb idea. Or would enough of the smaller teams cross over for the lure of higher gate revenues?

This is what I was thinking. The teams left behind who still have a little power should refuse to schedule any of them. Let them fill their schedules with UAA, Quinnipiac, RIT, Holy Cross (OH NO!), etc.

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This is what I was thinking. The teams left behind who still have a little power should refuse to schedule any of them. Let them fill their schedules with UAA, Quinnipiac, RIT, Holy Cross (OH NO!), etc.

That's an idea. That's half an idea.

Holy Cross would be perfect in the Big Ten Hockey Conference.

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Good point. Even though it looks like the power is with the BT, this will negatively affect college hockey as a whole. Is it possible that if all of the other schools banded together and did not schedule non conference games against the BTHC teams, that they could force the demise of this dumb idea. Or would enough of the smaller teams cross over for the lure of higher gate revenues?

My bet is that gate revenues would trump any other considerations. For example, there is zero chance the Mankatos and St. Clouds of the world would turn down a home-and-home contract with the Gophers out of principle. Absolutely no chance of that happening. Heck, no way UND would turn it down.

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Let's face it, "regionalization" has nothing to do with Alvarez wanting to leave the WCHA. They are the top attendance team in the country, very wealthy, and would still likely fly to all their conference trips even in the new Big 10. The real reason Wisconsin wants to leave the WCHA is because it

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My bet is that gate revenues would trump any other considerations. For example, there is zero chance the Mankatos and St. Clouds of the world would turn down a home-and-home contract with the Gophers out of principle. Absolutely no chance of that happening. Heck, no way UND would turn it down.

Thats what I would be afraid off. But its short sighted. Sure they can take the gate from one home game, but they also will need to remember that they are going to be getting a decreased share of revenue from the Final Five. I would like to see them gamble and say No thanks. Sure they will miss out on a gate, but if the BTHC folds after a couple of years and UW and UM come back to the WCHA, those gates will return along with with increased Final Five revenue. Its a gamble and I don't think many teams would go for it, but it sure would be nice if they did.

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Let's face it, "regionalization" has nothing to do with Alvarez wanting to leave the WCHA. They are the top attendance team in the country, very wealthy, and would still likely fly to all their conference trips even in the new Big 10. The real reason Wisconsin wants to leave the WCHA is because it
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Let's face it, "regionalization" has nothing to do with Alvarez wanting to leave the WCHA. They are the top attendance team in the country, very wealthy, and would still likely fly to all their conference trips even in the new Big 10. The real reason Wisconsin wants to leave the WCHA is because it
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I don't think any of the Big Ten teams think they would be missing any rivals at all. For example, there would be no chance that UND/SCSU/Mankato/Duluth would turn down an offer from the Gophers to play, so we'd still get those games.

Plus the less hardcore fans would much rather see Michigan/tOSU/MSU than Bemidji/Omaha/UAA/MTU/etc.

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It's my understanding Wisconsin offered UND an opportunity to play at Camp Randall a year ago but Cal Poly took our place. That would seem to indicate the Badgers would still play the Sioux even if the Big Ten hockey conference were establsihed. I know Wisconsin is big enough financially to be able to get what it wants. Is this reminiscent of Michigan, Michigan State and Notre Dame leaving the WCHA years ago? I would think the WCHA is well enough known that it would still be one of the power hockey conferences in the country. Not saying I want it to happen, but I think we'd survive very nicely. After all, Denver and CC are still very potent teams with a proud history and background. What are the chances if a Big Ten conference is formed in hockey that UND might be admitted as an associate member?

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It's my understanding Wisconsin offered UND an opportunity to play at Camp Randall a year ago but Cal Poly took our place. That would seem to indicate the Badgers would still play the Sioux even if the Big Ten hockey conference were establsihed. I know Wisconsin is big enough financially to be able to get what it wants.
After the NCAA settlement, Wisconsin will play the Sioux in other sports. Cal Poly prevailed as a choice as a UND win would not have counted for the Badger's bowl eligibility.

What are the chances if a Big Ten conference is formed in hockey that UND might be admitted as an associate member?
The Gophers would really need to go to bat for us. If the requirement is that any hockey associate member be FBS also (like Miami, BGSU, and WMU), then UND would either need to move up to FBS or settle in the WCHA.
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It's my understanding Wisconsin offered UND an opportunity to play at Camp Randall a year ago but Cal Poly took our place. That would seem to indicate the Badgers would still play the Sioux even if the Big Ten hockey conference were establsihed. I know Wisconsin is big enough financially to be able to get what it wants. Is this reminiscent of Michigan, Michigan State and Notre Dame leaving the WCHA years ago? I would think the WCHA is well enough known that it would still be one of the power hockey conferences in the country. Not saying I want it to happen, but I think we'd survive very nicely. After all, Denver and CC are still very potent teams with a proud history and background. What are the chances if a Big Ten conference is formed in hockey that UND might be admitted as an associate member?

None, IMHO. I think they would take Notre Dame on as an affiliate member. However, I think there's still a good possibility of Notre Dame becoming a full Big Ten member after the NBC football contract runs out in 2015. The Big Ten is basically saving the twelfth spot for them.

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Thats what I would be afraid off. But its short sighted. Sure they can take the gate from one home game, but they also will need to remember that they are going to be getting a decreased share of revenue from the Final Five. I would like to see them gamble and say No thanks. Sure they will miss out on a gate, but if the BTHC folds after a couple of years and UW and UM come back to the WCHA, those gates will return along with with increased Final Five revenue. Its a gamble and I don't think many teams would go for it, but it sure would be nice if they did.

The decreased revenue is due to? 2 new teams? Minny leaving and having to play the Final 5 in a smaller venue? Please explain.

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Didn't see this brought up: why couldn't the new 6 team BTHC play 25 conference games and 8 NC-games?

IE, play the other 5 teams 5 times each (rotate 2away/3home and 3home/2away each year). Then you only need to find 2, 3 4 NC opponents a year depending if you want a home/home or 2home/2home.

MN could play the BTHC conf schedule plus a 2home/2home and 2 home/home (3 NC opp a year), rotating between UND, SCSU, MSU, UMD, DU and CC.

Wouldn't that save money, esp. playing 25 conf. games in the upper midwest and not having to travel to the west region every year.

I would love to see that happen as it would open up the remaining WCHA (UAA, DU, CC, UND, SCSU, MSU, UMD, BSU, UNO) to a future NDSU and possibly Moorhead State hockey team(s). Maybe drop UAA to save money?

NDSU - Moorhead

DU - CC

SCSU - MSU

BSU - UND

UNO - UMD (not ideal)

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I would love to see that happen as it would open up the remaining WCHA (UAA, DU, CC, UND, SCSU, MSU, UMD, BSU, UNO) to a future NDSU and possibly Moorhead State hockey team(s). Maybe drop UAA to save money?

NDSU - Moorhead

DU - CC

SCSU - MSU

BSU - UND

UNO - UMD (not ideal)

Im not going to adress this actual issue, but are you assuming Michigan Tech leaves as well? Otherwise that leaves you with 13 teams. And if your scenario would play out, the pairings would look like this:

NDSU-Moorhead

DU-CC

SCSU-UND

BSU-UMD

UNO-MSU

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