scpa0305
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Posts posted by scpa0305
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Schlossman tweeted
It really makes you wonder....
It seems like CHL teams offer these kids the world and convince them that because they are the 'best development league in the world' they will be NHL regulars in 18-24 months, when in reality, only a small percentage actually will be. Yes, college degrees can be obtained later in life, but for many it's easier said than done.
I'm always reminded of Jack Campbell. When he decommitted from Michigan he said that by going the CHL route he would be playing in the NHL in two years. It has been more than two years and Campbell only recently started playing in the AHL. His replacement at Michigan (Shawn Hunwick) saw NHL time this past season. Ouch!
When it comes down to it, there isn't a 'fastest route' to the NHL. It's all about a kid's ability and drive. And honestly, I don't hate the CHL as a development league, I hate the constant harrassment of committed recruits.
I pretty much agree with everything you said. Don't hate the player....hate the game kind of thing. Because of NCAA regulation they simply can't compete (currently) with the CHL (or NHL actaully as the NHL pretty much funds the CHL leagues). Tough situation.
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I still fail to see how the CHL are the bad guys in this.
Their GMs can be leaches...but you are correct I really don't think they are the "bad guys". Also, they offer money under the table to players (which is against their rules but rarely enforced). They get a bad rep because of the players that leave college to play their at the instruction of the team which drafted them (a majority of the time).
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Agree with most of what you said, but how is it college hockey's fault that the CBA has that loophole?
Isn't it the NHLPA and the owners' faults?
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And how many players have used that rule, in total? Blake Wheeler, Schultz......Gregoire right? Who else?
Seems like the impact of that loophole has been a bit exaggerated.
I don't have any of the answers all I know is that something has to change because some of the current flaws are pretty obvious. You are correct with all those players you listed....there are probably some more but those are some of the ones I know of. I am trying to look at this as unbiasedly as possible, it is very easy to come on this message board and sound off on the CHL, but I think a better use of our time would be to look at the flaws. Also, I never said once it was college hockey fault, youre right it is the NHLPA and the NHLs fault. But there are former college players within the NHLPA and they should be speaking up on some of these issues to promote the developmental route they took. All I'm saying, is that from a business perspective, it is much more risky to draft a college bound player than a CHL bound player under the current rules. I guarantee that if you took a pole of all NHL gms a majority would say the same thing. I just think US Hockey/NCAA must work with the NHL to try and resolve some of these "exaggerated" flaws...as you call it. Because US kids are starting to jump ship more and more and I bet this trend just gets worse unless some sort of pack is established.
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An NHL team may lay out options but they'll leave it up to the player. JT Miller bails on us as a NY Ranger pick and I think that is on him. The Rangers have been successful with college kids that play a few years like McDonagh and Stepan. Not to mention, they just drafted Skjei in the 1st round and he'll be playing for Minnesota. Each individual is different. I think it comes down to how committed a kid actually is to the college route in the first place. If they sense he isn't fully committed to it, they probably allude to other options.
I bet he does...but I wouldn't say, at this point, he is a lock. I really think it depends on the player. If they are more relaxed and layed back and simply want to play hockey....they go with their gut on where they want to go. If they are uber dedicated and will do anything to get into the League....they will most likey do whatever the NHL gms want them to do...even back out of their prior commitments.
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An NHL team may lay out options but they'll leave it up to the player. JT Miller bails on us as a NY Ranger pick and I think that is on him. The Rangers have been successful with college kids that play a few years like McDonagh and Stepan. Not to mention, they just drafted Skjei in the 1st round and he'll be playing for Minnesota. Each individual is different. I think it comes down to how committed a kid actually is to the college route in the first place. If they sense he isn't fully committed to it, they probably allude to other options.
Yeah I am really not trying to preach either route, I'm just saying that if you were an 18 year old kid and an NHL GM gives you his idea of what you should do (go to the CHL) I think many would follow their advice. Also, I am not saying the CHL doesn't poach players....because obviously they do. I am saying these guys that bounce right after the draft are being told what to do. Now some of them may be strong willed in their deceision (ex. Schmaltz) other may simply want to do whatever they can do to get to the NHL and if they are NHL GMs directing them on what to do, I'm guessing they listen.
What I think is that something needs to change regarding the rules. I do believe something has to be done with players that are committed....they must at least play one year for that school. Also, something must be done to get the NHL to support college hockey. The NHL owns a very large portion of the CHL, obviously that is why they want their prospects to go there. Also, the 4 yr rule that says a player can become a free agent after 4 years is absolutely killing college hockey's reputation in the NHL. The Justin Schultz situation is a great example. The guy stayed an extra year in school and then he gets to hit free agency and the Ducks pretty much lose one of their top prospects because of a technicality. Again, I love college hockey but some "fine print....loopwhole" rules must change in order for it to become more popular to the NHL gms....otherswise drafting a college bound players becomes too risky (for business purposes).
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According to multiple twitter reports, the Plymouth Whalers have once again successfully poached an NCAA player right after the draft. This time it's Michigan recruit Connor Carrick (5th round draft pick).
Carrick appeared to be 100% committed to Michigan and talked about it during his post-draft interviews. A week later, he's off to Plymouth. He would have been a freshman this fall.
*Note: news has not been confirmed by Michigan, Plymouth, Washington or Carrick. It's all twitter reports at the moment.
Ok my buddy's little cousin got drafted last week and from what I hear it is not even 100% the CHL's fault for poaching....there is no poaching going on after the draft. The kids meeting with the NHL GMs and they tell their draft picks how they should continue their development which would obviously be to go to the CHL. After the whole Justin Schultz debacle, I could understand why NHL GMs would push the CHL route....it's a business decision and when kids go to college and stay there, it get's risky for the team that drafted them. It sucks. The NHL must change the 4-yr rule to 6 yrs or something. Because we are losing a lot of our talent.
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He was good at Holy Angels before and really took another big step up last year after transfering to Edina. I was very impressed with his play in the state tournament and would agree that he was one of the top and most exciting players in the tournament. He definitely has a lot of potential and a bright future. I am sure UND is interested in him and I would guess the usual suspects like Minnesota and Wisconsin will be going after him as well and he will have his choice of where he wants to play at the next level, but I haven't seen or heard anything about which way he might be leaning at all.
OK thanks, yeah he was pretty fun to watch. He cracked the pipe with 2 minutes left against Benilde which would have had them in the Chip. Oh well, I really hope he doesn't play for the Gophs.
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What is all the debate for? Dell is not going anywhere soon since he will not be signed unless an ECHL team needs a goalie real bad.
Agreed, I may be wrong but isn't there one more week of Habs summer camp? After that they usually offer contracts. I ma be wrong on my timing so if that camp is already over, yes he would be coming back if no contract has been offered. Which I could live with, he'll end up splitting time with Gothberg.
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i saw something last week that indicated he was going to make up his mind after the Florida prospects camp. also, heard going to summer school, so i'd bet he's coming back.
I still think he is coming back too, as this is pretty late in the game (although I did hear what you mentioned...that he was waiting until after camp) but some of those guys still take summer classes to get their degrees. The fact he is going to school shouldn't be the sole factor determining whether he stays or goes. All in all, he has NHL talent and should bounce....good riddance I say.
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Ugh guys... all I'm saying is that Saunders played every game behind a hideous defense. I'm thinking his numbers will improve with UND. He wouldnt be coming here if he didn't have talent. We'll see.
Yeah....and we agreed with that.
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National Select 17's have been going on this week, you can follow it here,
http://www.usahockey...DivisionID=2100
I would really like to know where Conner Hurley (Columbia team if you click the link) is going. I watched him in last year's MN state tourney and besides Besse champsionship game, Hurley was the best kid in the Tourney and by "kid", he was only a sophomore last year. Seemed pretty tall and lanky but was so good. He lead Edina's high school team in pts last season. If anyone has heard where he is going or who he is looking at please post. I have to think UND is at least taking a look at him.
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There is no way Gothberg will go to Canada. Jeff Frazee didn't go to Canada either he signed a pro deal.
Hope so. Anyway, yes I know Frazee went to the AHL. I was trying to point out (in limited fashion no less) that most players try a new location when they are not getting playing time. I remember Frazee was getting blown up frequently (remember Bina's cross ice goal) and he started losing playing time. He signed an AHL deal the next year and was (or was in consideration for) goalie of the year. I guarentee that if Gothberg is half way decent (which I know he is), Boston will want him seeing regular minutes.
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Whoosh....
Really? Sarcasm isn't recognized now without smileys?
You are correct sir. Some of us young guys don't fully get that old man sarcasm....that's supposed to be funny but really isn't....you know the stuff.
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Yeah, I guess I shouldn't have called him a godsend.... oh wait... I DIDN'T... thanks for putting words in my mouth. I am simply saying that this kid has been battle tested at the D-I level. Unlike Maris and Gothberg. Can Zane's numbers from the USHL translate to the WCHA? Maybe... I hope so. I used to coach the kid in little league baseball in Thief River, he's a great kid and I hope him a couple national titles at UND, but he hasn't been there yet.
You are being extremely hypocritical by saying my stats are anecdotal and then offering one more game in your side of the arguement. I am no where near saying Saunders is in any way a "godsend." I am only saying that his experience shows he can perform. Put this kid behind a top flight defense at UND and he could be pretty damn good. So could Gothberg. It's all for the sake of argument. Do you think those performances in question were all the fault of Saunders? Could it possibly have been the defense in front of him? I think so... Will this kid be elite? I have no clue. Will he be serviceable and better with a good defense? In my opinion, without a doubt.
I like your follow up response...you are, for the most part, right on here. However, I would simply like to note that it is perfectly fine to overlook saunders because he is a goalie coming from a program that couldn't hang in the MIAC (D3). I would actaully say Gothberg has more pressure (if Dell leaves) as he is the goaile with awesome accolades. Saunders simply has to come in and be steady. I still think Gothberg will end up being the starter though...or he'll bounce to Canada at some point in his career (ala Jeff Frazee).
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Not only small, but highly anecdotal. He also allowed 7 goals in 35 shots against Air Force, 6 goals on 18 shots against Mankato (pulled in the second), 4 goals on 14 shots against Bemidji (pulled in second), 5 goals on 26 shots against Denver (pulled after second).
Yeah UND was looking at this kid during recruiting and he had a deficient team in front of him in Alabama, but to suggest that he is a godsend or anything half that is unfair to both Clarke and your own senses. I wish Clarke the best at UND; yet, a goalie who originally signed with Alabama-Huntsville is not who I want starting game in and game out in North Dakota's net----for obvious reasons. He'll provide experienced depth, but nothing more if Hak and crew did their due diligence getting a guy like Gothberg.
Yeah I was about to post but the guy really had no argument. I hope Saunders is very good....and I think I just may. However, yes the kid's stood on his head a few nights, but the team in from of him was god awful. So there will be some nights where his numers look great and others where they look terrible. He may have had 60 shots a game, but because his team was so bad....I'm guessing a lot of those shots were clean looks from 4th liners. Also, how does an awesome goalie from Canada end up in Alabama...not very often I would add. I am guessing he must have peaked late....as why would the Sioux even pull him in if he wasn't decent. I will just say that going into the year....this kid has absolutely nothing on Gothberg. But during the season anything can happen. We'll see.
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I know that article is recent however I read the exact same article from a different source a while back. Schmaltz is coming for sure....as for his brother, who knows. I have seen his brother play and he is very, very good for his age. I am thinking he may bounce to the CHL when he is 16 (eligible), I hope I'm wrong though.
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No, no, no.
The reason is that people confuse UND with NDSU. Even there. It's not that they want UND stuff. They think they are buying NDSU stuff.
Don't you learn anything on these forums?
I hope you are being sarcastic, I don't see any smiley faces...
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A huge step backwards for UND sports. Suspect FTA and FCS may, just may, have one more year, but when the new conference and contract with CBSSports starts, all bets are off. Although, at least last year, CBSSports could be found FTA at times (maybe all the time?). Of course, that's just a couple games/year, as Midco now controls who gets what, and I'd be surprised if they allow FTA. I'm in North Dakota but out of the Midco footprint (as are most others outside ND), so no Sioux sports for us. All the fans in the Cities that go to Sensors will be out of luck as well.
Yeah the manager at Sensors told me that once this kicks in they no longer will be able to show the UND games...terrible. There are atleast 10-15 UND fans at Sensors every weekend to watch their games....somtimes more.
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Has anyone heard whether or not Aaron Dell is going pro for sure or not? I have heard he is attending his pro camp, but nothing on if he will sign or not.
Otherwise what is our goalie situation for next year? Gothberg? The kid from Alabama-Huntsville?
Without Dell this could be a soft spot for us next year. Thought?
Gothberg may be just as good as Dell right now...or better. I'm guessing at some point during the year Gothberg takes the job no matter who is on the team.
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Sioux hockey....and it's not even close. Dumb poll.
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Well. because in an area that doesn't have a lot of tops sports teams, hockey reminds everyone around the country that we have a decent sports school. It gives us recognition to the global hockey community. When you mention college hockey, you cannot forget to mention UND. Almost everyone else hates the Sioux (UND) but it is for a specific reason....year in and year out we throw out very tough teams to beat. Team love to play us in non-conference games (and WCHA games) because when the Sioux is in town they arenas are packed and tickets are sold. Those are just a couple of reasons for me.
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Add Jaden Schwartz to that. Gotta love the college flavor of the Blues.
Yup, congrats to Schmaltz, great organization to go to.
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I've heard that this is going to be one of the weaker and more unpredictable draft classes in years, so I'm not going to start freaking out because there may not be any college players in the first round, this year.
Besides, I don't know what college hockey is supposed to do, you can't win 'em all--some players are going to prefer the CHL to college hockey. Especially Canadians.
Agreed, and the turnout was actually pretty decent for college hockey (so far).
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2 great non conference series in bu and nd! Wish they could have had a 4 team subway deal but sometimes it's not that easy when scheduling. Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't those 2 early Alaska games regarded as " extra " games?? Due to the long travel or did I hear that incorrect at some point? Thanks
NHL draft tonight (1st round only) and the rest tomorrow! Would be great to see Schmaltz go tonight in the 1st round.
Me too, however, I think his down year (regular season) will push him out of the first round. After his awesome rookie year, there was talk of him going top ten.
NCAA Hockey Scores and Updates (Non-Sioux)
in Men's Hockey
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I agreed with her post. Everything I mentioned after that were my own thoughts. You pretty much disagree with everything I say even when you do slightly agree with me. Go get more information on this topic...then post something. Or I might ask, why do you think more kids than ever are going to the CHL? Just to go to Canada? If you think some of these kids are simply being persuaded by only the CHL you are wrong....the NHL teams that draft them push for them to go to the CHL. If you are a kid with NHL aspirations you are going to listen to who took the time to draft you (most of the time).