[UND to cut women's hockey]

Don't want to go over the top with my feelings on this as we are now 16 days past when they were cut. I think they are going to lose a lot of the people that were sympathetic, but knew it was the right call. I realize they don't care, but it's really disappointing (but not surprising) to see them go the sexist route. We've talked about the stages of grief, it's clear to me that they have finally accepted that it's not coming back. This has turned their denial into anger and they are ready to go scorched earth on the University. They are going to (have the entire time) try to make the University look as bad as they can. The first couple weeks, I think it was more for sympathy, now it's strictly for revenge.

Now, I've wanted the team gone since the D1 transition, because I knew that as long as we had this anchor (Women's hockey), we would never be able to see what this University's full potential could be athletically. The sympathy I had though, is gone. I was annoyed by the team while they were on campus (because of the cost), now I truly dislike them.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

Schools move around money in their athletic department, so I'm with @Bison Dan that lets look at the final number of UND losing 1.4M and NDSU made 1.8M. Looking at this objectively, there's no doubt that last year and years prior that NDSU's athletic department was in much better shape than UND's. I don't really think there's even an argument to be made, because Kolpack is correct that almost every single program at this level lose money (except NDSU Football, UND Men's Hockey). NDSU will continue to do well, they have the right number of sports and play in conferences that fit their location. 

As insensitive as this statement is going to be, because peoples lives (not just in athletics, but academically as well) were altered, this budget crisis was blessing in disguise for UND. It forced the hand of UND to make cuts that should have been made a long time ago. That probably wouldn't have been made otherwise and they would have continued to be spread thin, with way too many sports. Getting the 3 sports they cut off the books, by Kolpacks numbers that's 2.75 million that goes away. UND can put money into Football and Basketball, will save more money once the conference switch happens. Revenues will go up in Football if Bubba keeps this program on track. Will be interesting to see this article in 2 years.

[Conference Realignments - Take 2]

6 minutes ago, Rebel_Sioux said:

How much does North Dakota save by switching conferences? Originally it made sense geographically and puts us with more rivals. And honestly, despite the Slummit comments it seems to be on par strengthwise. 

 

That being said, it also seems to be creating more headaches (limited our options to cut sports, teams might be leaving etc). So was it worth it?  What's the concensus here?

I agree that originally it made a lot of sense, but what's going on in the MVC and Horizon have made me feel a little uneasy. If multiple teams jump from the Summit we could be in trouble. Cutting sports on the other hand was a must and the ones that were chosen were ideal. UND needed to be at 16 sports, period. To sum it up, now that UND has the correct number of sports, if a nightmare scenario happens with Summit teams leaving, we should have stayed in the Big Sky. If things shake out ok, it will still be the right move, save half a million on travel a year, increase revenue by playing rivals.   

[UND to cut women's hockey]

1 hour ago, SIOUXFAN97 said:

when does idalski have to turn in his key to REA?  on OTL the female hockey player seemed to be interviewed from inside REA?  when are the doors gonna be locked

There's been a fair share of misinformation out there, but I also recall a women's hockey player say that the team is still practicing and that was after the announcement.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

30 minutes ago, cberkas said:

Looks like everyone is ignoring Toms story.

Pretty big news story and nothing but crickets. 

[Early departures 2017]

Absolutely incredible news, a real game changer for the team next year. This team is going to be so deep. I realize they are losing two forwards that are currently in the NHL, but I am so excited for this team next year.

[One Week Later]

It has now been a week since the Women's hockey program has been cut at UND, I'm interested to hear if the general reaction has been bigger than you thought, about the same, or not as bad. Has anything surprised you?

• On TV, Print and Radio
• Social Media

Looking forward, how long until things start to slow down as far as Social Media campaigns, stories, ect... A month? Longer?

[COMMITTED UND Recruits]

Braden Costello with 2G 2A in 6GP and Gavin Hain 4G 1A in 12GP seem to be doing pretty well in the USHL following their high school seasons. I hope both decide to play full time in the USHL for their senior seasons, does anyone know what their plans are?

Looking at that 2000 birth year, you have Tychonick who will be playing his second year in BCHL, JBD will be playing his second year in the AJHL. Frisch with the late birthday will only be a Junior in HS. Would be nice to have all four of the early 2000's playing in the juniors their senior years. 

My main concerns right now are with Keane (97) and a little less with Senden (98). Keane isn't scoring at all and he's on a first place team. What are the chances these two ever make it to campus?

[President Kennedy Message on Athletics]

How is it possible that Men's hockey only only has $3.7 million in ticket revenue? Taking out student tickets lets just say they average 7,500 a game (understatement), lets say the average ticket is $30 (understatement) that's $225,000 per game. 19 home games in the 15'-16' schedule, that's $4.275 million. That's going on the low end ($40 tickets Friday, $50 Saturday for adults). I know there are youth tickets for $25, but for a Saturday night game for a full house, it's easy $100,000 more than my per game estimate. 

[UND to cut women's hockey]

He could have had a gracious response, but still added a little substance. What's annoying is everyone on this board can see it coming, but apparently those in charge cannot. This isn't just going to go away by playing nice. The response to the email was fine, but it should have come simultaneously with a statement, laying everything out like many have said today, with facts and numbers.  UND is armed with all the ammunition they need to end this right now, the problem is it feels like they have no idea what potentially is about to hit them.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

40 minutes ago, sprig said:

It's time for UND to clear up the mess and put out exact numbers for costs and needed savings and how dropping other sports other than women's hockey would not work to stay in line with title 9.. There was nothing given at the news conference last week, unless Faison and Kennedy were more forthcoming in the 1 on 1's with the press afterwards. I've seen many numbers here but the athletic department has made a mess of this. I think Kennedy and the AD did what they had to do, but please explain. Anything I know or don't know comes from this forum, and while many of you know a lot more than me concerning the cuts, ti's time to hear if from the horse's mouth. What sport's exactly do the Lammy twins want to cut to make up for the budget cuts? 

 

22 minutes ago, Siouxperfan7 said:

Kennedy should just respond that if the womens hockey team wants to still be around, they are going to have to be privately funded like the golf team is doing.  Give them the dollar value that they will need to come up with, and see what they can do.  Of course, you can't expect to fund a program on a year to year basis, so they will need to develop a long term endowment plan so it can be sustained long term. Just like what was proposed to the golf team.  If they can raise the millions of dollars needed to afford the program next year and for years in the future, then more power to them.  The program is saved!  Rality will set in when they see the actual hard numbers.

This is a great way for Kennedy and Faison to respond and give the actual dollar amounts needed.  I would be willing to bet 75% of the people taking to social media don't know the amount of money that is required to sustain the program.

Absolutely on the first post, absolutely not on the second.

First: UND has the opportunity to write a response that could effectively end the discussion. We need not only numbers, but they need to be clear that without cutting hockey, for them to get to the target amount, they'd have to cut X amount of sports, which would have impacted X amount of students. Don't let this turn into a USA Hockey situation, where it spins out of control. I can tell you what side the media is going to take. Even if your reasoning is sound, it's very, very tough to win an argument when the opposition plays victim card.

Second: I get where you're going with it and I can agree that they'd never hit the number needed, but I want nothing to do with opening that can of worms. It was a terrible idea to do it with Baseball and Golf and would be equally bad with Women's hockey. I hope they learned from the earlier headaches and wouldn't even entertain the thought.

[University of North Dakota Hockey 2017-18 Season]

Here's another crack at a potential lineup. This might not exactly have the best 6 in the Top 6, but with more thought into a lineup that will be extremely effective up and down. Unlike the first one, this includes Poganski, with the hope that he is more leaning towards coming back (per Schlossman).

Gersich - Kawaguchi - Adams (Yon / Wilkie)

Poganski - Gardner - Mismash

JJ - Hoff - Bowen

Olson - Simonson - Smith

(Gornall, Jones, Wilkie, Adams or Yon)

Poolman - Shaw

Wolanin - Peski

Johnson - Bast

(Rieger, Chartrand)

You throw one or two Freshman into the fire and see how they respond with Gersich. The key to this lineup though is lines 2-4, where I have a hard time believing that many teams could match 2nd line for 2nd line, even fewer 3rd for 3rd, same with 4th for 4th. For games against teams with high powered first lines, match up UND's 2nd with them. If Poganski and Gerisch stay, this team will be very good. 

[University of North Dakota Hockey 2017-18 Season]

3 minutes ago, The Sicatoka said:

Yes, and then more so. 

That's what I see as well.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

8 minutes ago, HawksHoops said:

Complete lack of understanding and empathy for anyone, but themselves.  Over the last two years, many good people at UND (Admin, Staff and Faculty) have lost their jobs.  Their Jobs!  Advocating for more firings to save sports losing a combined $2M-$3M annually is completely out of touch with reality.  

BTW - The Herald's crack staff were on the scene with video and it looks like guys hanging the banners so I am not attributing this to any specific team on campus. 

Very good to know.

In general, it's tough when you are the one that is impacted, but now you're just making a bad situation, much worse. Like someone else said, the complete lack of awareness for faculty that have been cut is disgusting.

Let's just get through this next month and a half, UND will be much better and stronger than they were before.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

13 minutes ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

Looks like a couple of WH players are not going to get their UND Housing linen deposit back.

Pathetic.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

11 minutes ago, TNF said:

I get what you are saying but why is this solely on Brad's shoulders?  He has an editor and Forum Communication should want to get this right. To be fair, Miller wrote the "it could be good for other sports piece". And ultimately they are using what is fed to them via press releases and quotes from UND's administration. If you want to be mad at the message UND is the source and did a terrible job of laying out the black and white position based on the financials and cutting the smallest amount of athletes.

This also has to be said.  For all of you embarrassed, upset, mad at UND and/or Brad, remember the real source of the issue is the North Dakota budget.  Instead of directing all of your anger at the school realize every administrator from UND was put in a lose-lose position based on events almost entirely out of their hands.  Did they handle it perfectly?...no.  Was there a perfect way to handle it?...no.  Being upset is justified just always make sure to point it in the direction best positioned to deal with it...in this case your legislator if you live in ND. 

PS- Please do not make this a political thread. I'm simply pointing out the problem was bigger than UND and therefore blame should be bigger than UND. 

Last thing I'm going to say about Brad, but come on. Go through his timeline Wednesday. If you think he tried to get out any financials or would have, you're nuts. He was on a mission that day (and still is) to torpedo the University for what they did to WIH. That's a fact.

 

Edit: Torpedo might be the wrong word, but like I said earlier, he is hell bent on making them look as bad as possible while only giving 1/2 the story.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

13 minutes ago, aschmitz_88 said:

The title IX consultant was a big sign.  Unfortunately (if someone has mentioned it I apologize) deadspin picked up on Brad's tweets and Lauren's and wrote an article: http://deadspin.com/north-dakota-cuts-womens-hockey-and-leaves-recruit-out-1793872610

I am now with an earlier comment made by UNDColorado who (maybe along with others) painted Brad's twitter feed as shall I say harmful...I like his articles on info relating to college hockey but the tweets about WIH are not helpful.  Certainly seemed like an agenda...as opposed to a reporter...

 

The book has been out on Brad for awhile, he's a very good beat reporter when it comes to covering UND Men's hockey. That being said, there are certain subjects that he goes from reporter to activist. This is a huge problem, because instead of reporting all the facts and stating both sides of something, like any activist, he can only see one side. The problem yesterday, is he is one of the main sources of information for this huge event. A lot of eyes were on him, most who hadn't been following this story closely and we all saw how that ended up. Disappointing, embarrassing, are just a few words to describe how he handled it. You just can't leave out 1/2 the story when you are one of the main sources. Not only leave out the why, but grab anything you could to make the administration and UND look as bad as possible, he was hell bent on it.  If you've followed him for awhile, it couldn't have been less surprising though sadly. 

[University of North Dakota Hockey 2017-18 Season]

51 minutes ago, yzerman19 said:

So guaranteed top 6:  Pogo, Gardner, Gersich,

In the hunt for top 6:  Mismash, Guch, Adams, JJ, Hoff, Jones

In the lineup:  Simo Olson Bowen

Battling:  Gornall Yon Wilkie Smith 

 

7 minutes ago, geaux_sioux said:

Gornal and Smith must be in the line up.  They add too much grit and intensity to have them watching from the stands.

Let's even take Pogo out of the equation, based strictly on the tweet from the Blues writer (which who knows). We don't know what we are going to get from the freshman, but this seems to be a very solid class of forwards, all who can contribute. When you look at the battling category, that's a great group of forwards all who were either freshman or sophomores this year (same with the rest of the lineup). Next year might not have the big names in the college hockey world, but when was the last time they're going to be this solid up and down the lineup? This team is going to be very deep. 

Who is going to have a Gerisch type offensive explosion next year? 

[UND to cut women's hockey]

If it was a good product, people would show up, period. This team could have had 18 Olympians on it and it wouldn't matter. People weren't interested, if they were they would have shown up. I don't see how this is even an argument. 

[President Kennedy Message on Athletics]

13 minutes ago, terbele said:

Has there been any analysis reported that lays out exactly how UND got into this position?  What was the impetus to spend/commit future revenue on the come?  It has to be that as we are not hearing/seeing anything out of NDSU that speaks to parallel actions.  

Not looking to blame someone but would like to understand what exactly happened.

Very few collegiate programs make money. NDSU has always had 16, compared to 21 at UND as of last year. Trimming 5 sports (including golf which pays its own way now) over the past year will save $4 million a year in the expense department. Long story short, NDSU had the right amount of sports for the school of its size, UND did not. They do now. 

[University of North Dakota Hockey 2017-18 Season]

5 minutes ago, UNDSioux23 said:

Totally agree with this year's numbers he's put up!

I think both Kawaguchi and Adams are going to be fantastic college hockey players. One thing to note is Adams is a year younger and plays in the USHL, where stats are much harder to come by. Regardless, love bringing in Top 10 scorers from either league.

This is going to be a very good Freshman class.

[President Kennedy Message on Athletics]

13 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

I refuse to click on all things mcfeely.  Anything worth noting?

Not any new information for anyone that has been following closely, but it was a great interview for someone who needed an overview. I want Faison on every radio station with the same questions. It's something the uneducated on the issues that are up in arms really need to hear.

[President Kennedy Message on Athletics]

17 minutes ago, UNDColorado said:

Maybe so Cratter. I am just calling out his one sided bull$%!# and some people can't handle it. On the other hand Tom Miller's article was fantastic. It had those pesky little facts in it.

Schlossman over the past couple years has turned into a clown. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, which I respect, but what he did yesterday was flat out embarrassing. As a reporter, you should lay out all of the facts and let people decide. You can absolutely have your own opinion, but get the facts out to the people. That wasn't the case yesterday, he found everything negative he could and spewed it to all his followers (The Reusse retweet was awful). He did his best to make UND look as bad as possible, while fueling the fire acting like he couldn't comprehend what happened (Olympians!!!). You can be mad, angry, but be professional and let people know this is why it happened. You don't agree with it for reasons A, B and C, but they did it because of D, E and F.

[Early departures 2017]

I really wish we could get a little more information on Poganski. In the article about Cam staying, Schlossman again words it in a way how they are waiting on Poganski / Gersich, but Poolman is basically gone, even though he hasn't signed. You would think it's more waiting on Gersich and Poganski / Poolman are basically gone.

[UND to cut women's hockey]

2 hours ago, UND1983 said:

Anyone else find it weird how quiet the REA is about this?  Maybe I missed it but haven't heard anything on their end.

So much for the "Women's hockey was wanted by Ralph and isn't going anywhere" argument.

That argument was said by only one person, but he said it over and over and over. Obviously wasn't true, which people tried to tell him, but he really stuck to it. I'll never understand things like that, preaching something like it's fact, when you have no clue.