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Cratter

Let it Be Known......

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that the greatest long term benefit for UND as far as DI conferences goes would be to get a conference formed with NDSU, SDSU, and USD.

There are four amazing state flagship schools that need to base a future conference around (the NCC - notice how iit will vanish after the four schools are gone). If this eventually works out Montana & Montana State will want to join it (if they are not already FBS/DIA). And possibly increasing attendance enough for the four schools to move collaberativly to DIA/FBS or at least position themselves.

Three States with the top two schools from each state. It would be a helluva conference that would be great for all parties because of people wanting to attend the games with less travel. It would be solid for years because basketball (and other sports) can't leave to jump to a higher division. Only switch to a "better conference" but hence everyone will already be apart of it.

Obstacles:

No autobid in the near future.

Need other members. Possibly Northern Iowa. I believe as SCSU grows (student wise) and becomes more of the "Metro" they will eventually move to DI or St. Thomas as a nonfootball (basketball) school.

I think the four schools should collaberate and do a feasibility study to see how to make this work.

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that the greatest long term benefit for UND as far as DI conferences goes would be to get a conference formed with NDSU, SDSU, and USD.

There are four amazing state flagship schools that need to base a future conference around (the NCC - notice how iit will vanish after the four schools are gone). If this eventually works out Montana & Montana State will want to join it (if they are not already FBS/DIA). And possibly increasing attendance enough for the four schools to move collaberativly to DIA/FBS or at least position themselves.

Three States with the top two schools from each state. It would be a helluva conference that would be great for all parties because of people wanting to attend the games with less travel. It would be solid for years because basketball (and other sports) can't leave to jump to a higher division. Only switch to a "better conference" but hence everyone will already be apart of it.

Obstacles:

No autobid in the near future.

Need other members. Possibly Northern Iowa. I believe as SCSU grows (student wise) and becomes more of the "Metro" they will eventually move to DI or St. Thomas as a nonfootball (basketball) school.

I think the four schools should collaberate and do a feasibility study to see how to make this work.

I think it makes alot of sense...however, my opinion of such a powerful conference is that ultimately not many of the parties will want to join it from the standpoint that only one of these great programs may make it into the playoffs each season. You could have 3 or 4 schools ranked in the top 20, possibly a couple in the top 5-10 and only get 1 into the playoff hunt.

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You could have 3 or 4 schools ranked in the top 20, possibly a couple in the top 5-10 and only get 1 into the playoff hunt.

It is something to consider.

The Four Schools somehow made it work pretty darn good for all those years in the NCC, until members left.......

Is this why NDSU left the NCC?

Having a pretty good team and sometimes not getting into the playoffs? Or was it truely the lure of FPS football? or Both?

The key question is would NDSU join this conference?

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It is something to consider.

The Four Schools somehow made it work pretty darn good for all those years in the NCC, until members left.......

Is this why NDSU left the NCC?

NDSU left the NCC because despite all their effort put forth to inform the NCC of the benefits of a conference move to DI, a majority did not share the vision.

Having a pretty good team and sometimes not getting into the playoffs? Or was it truely the lure of FPS football? or Both?

The key question is would NDSU join this conference?

No reason to leave the soon-to-be-named Missouri Valley, an autobid conference that has placed four teams in the playoffs in a single year.

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Is this why NDSU left the NCC?

NDSU left the NCC because they are a "football school" and really they were one of, if not THE, most successful football school in the history of DII and perhaps even one of the most successful schools back in the day of the "College Divsion" before the three divisional alignments took place in the early to mid 70's. With their past success, they were fed up with the watering down of DII as their peer institutions had already moved up to DI. NDSU and UND used to compete with the likes of Montana, Montana St., and Northern Iowa. Those schools, and others like them, made the leap in the late 70's and early 80's, and both North Dakota schools should have done the same at the time. NDSU was late to the party. And UND is even later. ???

As far as your proposal for a conference, it is a very nice thought, and I'll bet that all the schools you mentioned would have an open ear to it. But in reality it will never happen. The xDSU's are actually in a better conference situation than the Montana schools, both geography-wise and competetive wise. The Gateway is a better football conference than the Big Sky. The second and third place Gateway teams have a much better chance of getting an at-large bid than do the equal participants of the Big Sky, and that was true before the addition of NDSU which shoud be a perennial contender in the Gateway and FCS. Basketball is the primary concern for SDSU (and NDSU has been making headway in this area before Miles left) and they stand a much better chance of being competitve for the automatic berth in the Summit than they would in the Big Sky, or in a conference that included the schools you mentioned. Then there is NCAA requirements to meet regarding the autobids, which would really be the biggest hang up.

On the subject of potential/pipe dream conference arrangements, I still think that the Big Sky is the best option for UND. My newest revelation considers the DI moratorium. By 2011 when the moratorium is lifted, Montana (and Montana St.) will have had to endure 4 more zero to two win seasons by Northern Colorado and still the dilemma of Sac St. Montana, with their stadium expansion and drawing close to 25,000 per game will threaten to leave for the WAC (for real this time). MSU will be quick to follow. But they could be persuaded to stay if 1 or 2 more "peer" schools (UND and USD) are invited to join. Throw in Denver University to appease Fullerton and his thirst for small schools located in big markets, and you have a nice 12 team conference. Go to Divisional play for basketball, but not for football. Instead, adopt a Big 10-like football schedule, 11 football teams, but only play 8 conference games per year, skipping two teams per year.

I'll sign the contract when it is in front of me. :D;);)

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that the greatest long term benefit for UND as far as DI conferences goes would be to get a conference formed with NDSU, SDSU, and USD.

There are four amazing state flagship schools that need to base a future conference around (the NCC - notice how iit will vanish after the four schools are gone). If this eventually works out Montana & Montana State will want to join it (if they are not already FBS/DIA). And possibly increasing attendance enough for the four schools to move collaberativly to DIA/FBS or at least position themselves.

Three States with the top two schools from each state. It would be a helluva conference that would be great for all parties because of people wanting to attend the games with less travel. It would be solid for years because basketball (and other sports) can't leave to jump to a higher division. Only switch to a "better conference" but hence everyone will already be apart of it.

Obstacles:

No autobid in the near future.

Need other members. Possibly Northern Iowa. I believe as SCSU grows (student wise) and becomes more of the "Metro" they will eventually move to DI or St. Thomas as a nonfootball (basketball) school.

I think the four schools should collaberate and do a feasibility study to see how to make this work.

A nice idea, but the obstaces are far too high to be overcome without changes to NCAA policy. IMHO.

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Would it not be that tough if UND & USD got into, say, the Gateway League? (down the road by maybe losing a couple members to make room).

Thus almost controlling the conference to have it centered around them for future expansion?

They would even have UNI as a conference friend.

But one thing we've learned on these conference searches is leagues change, especially the mid-majors. Stable one day, looking for members the next. It looked bleak for NDSU after the Big Sky rejected it. But it wasn't long before the Mid-Con (now the Summit) saw two members leave in Chicago State and Valparaiso and NDSU suddenly had hope again to shed independent status.

So the key is to make the jump and hope for conference defections. It's a risk, but one that has to be made.

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If Moser can bring up old threads, does that mean I can too? (Although, this is more relevant as the plan was finalized and announced this past year).

On 9/13/2007 at 4:13 PM, Cratter said:

That the greatest long term benefit for UND as far as DI conferences goes would be to get a conference formed with NDSU, SDSU, and USD.

 

On 9/15/2007 at 1:08 AM, Cratter said:

Would it not be that tough if UND & USD got into, say, the Gateway League? (down the road by maybe losing a couple members to make room).

Thus almost controlling the conference to have it centered around them for future expansion?

Nailed it! :D

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