Kennedy vs. Engelstad Foundation: GF herald feature

[Siouxperfan7]

Bottom line is the Ralph and the Betty were built for the sole purpose to host UND sporting events.  They are the primary tenant.  The intention of the gift was operate within the best interests of UND.  So who decides what the best interests of UND are?  A trustee on the board of the Englestad Foundation or the actual President of the University of North Dakota?

[jdub27]

4 hours ago, Cratter said:

Mark Kennedy threw a huge hissy fit about not having the Fighting Hawk logo at center court and in the process upset some very important people.

That's your take or are you just trying to stir the pot again?

Kennedy and UND proposed how they would like to see the court redone since the whole building is done for the benefit of UND athletics (per signed contract). He included supporting documentation showing that the Athletic Director, Operations, Marketing and every head coach who plays in the facility also wanted to see that. On top of that, he included actual reasons why putting the logo at center court helps them and how not having it there could be harmful. The response was "too bad, we already approved what we wanted even though we know you don't support it". No reason given other than the preference of one person because well, I guess she just doesn't like the logo (but remember the Herald said it had nothing to do with the nickname!!). 

On top of that, people, including Jody Hodgson, Jeff Cooper (Engelstad Foundation Trustee) and James Waddoups (attorney who has worked with the Engelstads), spent 10 months coming up with a revised framework for the Usage Agreement and the REA Board promptly rejected it.

 

4 hours ago, Frozen4sioux said:

I believe Kennedy has blown this way out of proportion, the demands of financial harm are far fetched at best.

At this point in time Kennedy has to have some understanding that if he calls out this fight he is not going to win. Five years from now.......maybe. But he wont be here then anyway.

Yeah, Kennedy, standing up for his athletic department and operating in their best interests of the University he runs is what blew this out of proportion, not the person who decided they didn't like a logo and responded by running to the local paper to get their side of the story out and make all of this public.

For years people complained about not having a President who actually stood up for things, now that's all people can complain about. 

[Cratter]

2 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

That's your take or are you just trying to stir the pot again?

Kennedy asked to have the logo at center court.

They responded with sorry Mark youre too late we already voted and put the process in order.

Mark Kennedy goes on a tirade for not getting his way. Pissing off probably the entire Ralph Engelstad Arena organization.

[Frozen4sioux]

2 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

That's your take or are you just trying to stir the pot again?

Kennedy and UND proposed how they would like to see the court redone since the whole building is done for the benefit of UND athletics (per signed contract). He included supporting documentation showing that the Athletic Director, Operations, Marketing and every head coach who plays in the facility also wanted to see that. On top of that, he included actual reasons why putting the logo at center court helps them and how not having it there could be harmful. The response was "too bad, we already approved what we wanted even though we know you don't support it". No reason given other than the preference of one person because well, I guess she just doesn't like the logo (but remember the Herald said it had nothing to do with the nickname!!). 

On top of that, people, including Jody Hodgson, Jeff Cooper (Engelstad Foundation Trustee) and James Waddoups (attorney who has worked with the Engelstads), spent 10 months coming up with a revised framework for the Usage Agreement and the REA Board promptly rejected it.

the open records request certainly does shed an light on some disingenuous reporting.  I believe the Hodgsons response to the email from the ss.com board member today is a much more professional and honest approach to this that would have stavced off much of the bickering.  Like it or not, it was the truth, it was open and honest.

[UNDBIZ]

22 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Great job in reporting this it seems that the Herald could have done this in the first place.

My take.

If our student athletes are to snowflake hurt that they at "demoralized" by walking over the "Fighting Hawks" wordmark and then only seeing the branding wordmark at center court.

DON'T LET THE DOOR HIT YA WHERE THE GOOD LORD SPLIT YA!!!    I'm sure they may find a safespace somewhere at the University of Hurt Feelings or the campus of  Whiningbitch College.  

This is basically like being invited into another persons house to live and then demanding they paint the walls the color they like. No appreciation. They can play in Hyslop.

This is a process that can not be muscled 

I believe Kennedy has blown this way out of proportion, the demands of financial harm are far fetched at best.

At this point in time Kennedy has to have some understanding that if he calls out this fight he is not going to win. Five years from now.......maybe. But he wont be here then anyway.

You must realize you and those like you who cry every time you see the hawk logo are the snowflakes at this point, don't you?

[UNDBIZ]

16 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Would it have happened without the Engelstad blessing? Or would UND have had to pay much much more for a standalone arena ans support staff?  Is that not taken into account?

The Betty (under a different name, obviously) could have happened without the Engelstads.  "Would it" have happened requires speculation.

[SoonersNSioux]

I can't stand the logo and nickname (too generic for me), but regardless of that outcome. It is in the best interest of the U to embrace a common marketing strategy.  I don't see any issues with Kennedy's request, and his comments jive with the opinions of  students/athletes I have had interactions with. Shame on the Herald for subpar reporting and providing a venue for the REA folks to spew garbage.

[Frozen4sioux]

7 minutes ago, UNDBIZ said:

You must realize you and those like you who cry every time you see the hawk logo are the snowflakes at this point, don't you?

In no way, I don't get offended by the Fhawk logo, we don't cry,  I laugh at it,  but am not offended. 

An "athlete" that is emotionally damaged by seeing the words "North Dakota" instead of a logo, I have trouble supporting that.

[Teeder11]

7 minutes ago, SoonersNSioux said:

I can't stand the logo and nickname (too generic for me), but regardless of that outcome. It is in the best interest of the U to embrace a common marketing strategy.  I don't see any issues with Kennedy's request, and his comments jive with the opinions of  students/athletes I have had interactions with. Shame on the Herald for subpar reporting and providing a venue for the REA folks to spew garbage.

Bingo. In the Army, we used to say "One team, One fight."  The Bozos down south got it down pat.

[Teeder11]

4 minutes ago, Frozen4sioux said:

In no way, I don't get offended by the Fhawk logo, we don't cry,  I laugh at it,  but am not offended. 

An "athlete" that is emotionally damaged by seeing the words "North Dakota" instead of a logo, I have trouble supporting that.

But these are the athletes we love and cheer for, right? Our UND athletes. You do support them, though, don't you? If not, might as well be an NDSU fan or a Jackrabbits guy or God forbid a Goopher lover!  Yikes!!

[jdub27]

23 minutes ago, Cratter said:

Kennedy asked to have the logo at center court.

They responded with sorry Mark youre too late we already voted and put the process in order.

Mark Kennedy goes on a tirade for not getting his way. Pissing off probably the entire Ralph Engelstad Arena organization.

No. They had the vote after hearing what Kennedy had to say (multiple times) ignoring what the President, Athletic Director, Coaches and multiple operations people stated was in the best interest of UND.

• Kennedy had clearly expressed his point of view before March 28, when JH sent him an e-mail stating that KEM didn't want the logo.
• Kennedy responded on 3/30 detailing he was disappointed in this and further reiterated that the logo at center court was in the best interest of UND and attaches further supporting documents. Bill Chaves also responds backing this stance. JH responded he would pass on the information.
• JH sent an email on 4/20 saying that design work was in process but he thought the board was going to use the script instead of the logo regardless of whether it's actually in the best interest of UND and would contact him on 4/23 to discuss further (no final decision had yet been made).
• Kennedy sends an e-mail to multiple people on 4/25 regarding JH's previous e-mail, stating his disappointment and furthering his stance that the REA is not following their mission of operating in the best interest of UND 
• On 4/27, someone from the Engelstad Foundation responds the decision has already been made. The attachment includes a document titled "Betty Court Design - April 26 2018", indicating that was the date the design was finalized. 

Kennedy didn't go on any tirade after the final decision was made (or at least none that has been made public). If reminding KEM and the REA Board of Directors what their mission statement is pisses them off, then maybe it's time some of them are replaced. Tough to have a partnership when the entity who is supposed to be supporting another entity doesn't bother to listen in what ways they think the best way for that support to be employed is and instead operate on their own feelings.

[Cratter]

16 minutes ago, jdub27 said:

No. They had the vote after hearing what Kennedy had to say.

Maybe formally, but Mark went on a tirade after being told REA board has made up their minds and that they likely won't change their minds.

Marks second tirade (May 1) was made after being told court plans went out to contractors.

[The Sicatoka]

58 minutes ago, SiouxVolley said:

So McGarry and by extension Jacobs are upset by having a Hawk at center court.  This changes everything.

Kind of a junk-punch to ol' Mike: 
He finally got a new logo despite an Engelstad (Ralph). Now that he's got it, he can't get it because of an Engelstad (KEM). 

[The Sicatoka]

1 hour ago, jdub27 said:

And KEM's comments about it not being about the nickname seem to ring pretty hollow, ...

I'd say KEM's credibility in this whole matter just took a massive hit with that. 

She says "not about logo"; her emails say otherwise. There's a word for that ... 

[The Sicatoka]

1 hour ago, RobPort said:

For what it's worth, the Herald's reporting on the feud is what prompted my open records request, which I put in yesterday. The university turned it around promptly which, to their credit, they typically do.

@RobPort How'd I just know you lurk these-here parts. 

[MrEdway]

On 5/9/2018 at 10:11 PM, Frozen4sioux said:

Or maybe the Herald is just trying to sell papers.

Ill never get over the arrogance of people in Forks some times, do you realize what little we actually have up there?

Good lord keep dreaming.

And you would have much less if it wasn't for Ralph. UND hasn't had a competent president since Clifford.

[southpaw]

8 minutes ago, Cratter said:

Maybe not formally, but Mark went on a tirade after being told REA board has made up their minds and that they likely won't change their minds.

Marks second tirade (May 1) was made after court plans went out to contractors.

How are you able to not only breathe, but also type with your head so deep in the sand? 

[Cratter]

5 minutes ago, southpaw said:

How are you able to not only breathe, but also type with your head so deep in the sand? 

That's cool and all but that's the facts.

[southpaw]

6 minutes ago, Cratter said:

That's cool and all but that's the facts.

A few minutes ago, your "facts" were that Kennedy hadn't messaged before the vote. That's simply not true

[jdub27]

2 hours ago, Cratter said:

Maybe formally, but Mark went on a tirade after being told REA board has made up their minds and that they likely won't change their minds.

Marks second tirade (May 1) was made after being told court plans went out to contractors.

So you're saying people should just move on once minds have been made up and decisions aren't going to change? Interesting stance to take considering the crowd...

[Cratter]

5 minutes ago, southpaw said:

A few minutes ago, your "facts" werkge that Kennedy hadn't messaged before the vote. That's simply not true

Youre confusing formal vs informal voting.

[UND1983]

1 hour ago, Frozen4sioux said:

Great job in reporting this it seems that the Herald could have done this in the first place.

My take.

If our student athletes are to snowflake hurt that they at "demoralized" by walking over the "Fighting Hawks" wordmark and then only seeing the branding wordmark at center court.

DON'T LET THE DOOR HIT YA WHERE THE GOOD LORD SPLIT YA!!!    I'm sure they may find a safespace somewhere at the University of Hurt Feelings or the campus of  Whiningbitch College.  

This is basically like being invited into another persons house to live and then demanding they paint the walls the color they like. No appreciation. They can play in Hyslop.

This is a process that can not be muscled 

I believe Kennedy has blown this way out of proportion, the demands of financial harm are far fetched at best.

At this point in time Kennedy has to have some understanding that if he calls out this fight he is not going to win. Five years from now.......maybe. But he wont be here then anyway.

Are you able to read and comprehend?  THE COACHES all want the logo at midcourt.  COACHES-the one's who run the program and know what is best for their program's.    

These letters completely back up everything we have been saying about the REA not wanting to help UND transition to the nickname, etc.  Undeniable.

[fightingsioux4life]

1 hour ago, Frozen4sioux said:

This is basically like being invited into another persons house to live and then demanding they paint the walls the color they like. No appreciation. They can play in Hyslop.

1 hour ago, Frozen4sioux said:

This whole process makes me want to change donations from the Champions Club to the REA Foundation.

1 hour ago, Frozen4sioux said:

DONT PISS OF THE DONOR BASE.   Basically the first line on a President's job description.

 

 

And you said MY comments were "demented"? Look in the mirror buddy.

And if you really plan on taking money from the Champions Club, you are hurting the student-athletes that play on these teams that we cheer for.

But you have your nose so far up MISS McGarry's a$$, you can't see that.

[UND-FB-FAN]

14 hours ago, Frozen4sioux said:

You are delusional.

All of your scenerios are built on multiple assumptions built into a generalized "what if".

Its rediculous, it shows poor analytical reasoning skills, and worse yet it irresponsibly mis-informs people who would believe your rambling bull$%!# is based in knowledge instead of your own manufactued hopes and dreams.

I have corrected your manifesto for ethical reasoning and to call oit your BS and flawed thought process.

You do more damage to University of North Dakota Athletics than any deal ever could.

 

There you go again, criticizing someone because they don't believe in your extraordinarily biased views. You are tremendously one-sided in your thoughts (REA, Fighting Sioux, hockey priority) and, quite frankly, self-centered in regards to the desires of the actual UND students and student-athletes. 

You are exemplifying a trend that shows major deficiencies in your reasoning rather than everyone else's.    

[UND1983]

1 minute ago, fightingsioux4life said:

And you said MY comments were "demented"? Look in the mirror buddy.

And if you really plan on taking money from the Champions Club, you are hurting the student-athletes that play on these teams that we cheer for.

But you have your nose so far up MISS McGarry's a$$, you can't see that.

He cheers for one team only and they have a ton of money already.