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Brucesky02

Fargo Economy

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Let me be clear - I'm not trying to reinstate the previous topic used for discussing Fargo. This is not for discussing crime - just for business topics, like the Grand Forks one.

 

Anecdotally, it seems like Fargo is in a bit of a downturn. When I lived there, (2014-2016) I was worried about what I perceived as over-building in housing (especially in high end homes) and over-expansion of businesses. My feeling had been that the growth in restaurants/retail was being propped up by temporary demand increases due to the over-construction going on in the housing and retail markets. Once housing slowed, my thought had been the construction workforce would drop and demand for hotels/restaurants/retail along with that.

I've been seeing a number of articles about places closing and the housing market stagnating. Anyone have anything else that's out there with analysis on all this? I haven't been able to find any concrete housing numbers to look at other than the first article below. What other factors do you think are at play here? Oil?

Some examples of what I'm referencing:
http://www.inforum.com/news/4171949-many-unsold-homes-f-m-area-could-have-do-uncertainty-years-election
http://www.inforum.com/business/4101728-alerus-close-two-branches
http://www.inforum.com/business/4175317-moorhead-hotel-owner-says-construction-blame-recent-closure
http://www.inforum.com/variety/4084144-downtown-concert-venue-new-direction-close-fall
http://www.inforum.com/news/4009176-west-fargo-business-close-laying-dozens-employees
http://www.inforum.com/business/3948419-uptown-gallery-closing-after-deal-falls-through
https://www.wday.com/business/4192601-sears-store-west-acres-close-doors
https://www.wday.com/business/4118526-moorhead-kmart-close-years-end
http://www.inforum.com/business/4194143-fargos-lone-star-steakhouse-closes-after-23-years-business
http://www.inforum.com/business/4135338-fargos-coldwell-banker-first-realty-closing-friday
http://www.inforum.com/business/4116155-junk-giant-closing-downtown-fargo-owners-focus-vinyl-giant
http://www.inforum.com/business/3950180-grazies-italian-restaurant-close-saturday

 

From memory, you can also put in the recent RIP list:
-King Leo's
-TGI Fridays
-Quaker Steak
-Ole & Lena's Pizza (mall location)

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Rent is going up in buildings from West Acres to older parts of town, while the Kilbourne Group (headed by our new governor) gets 5-10 year tax breaks on buildings downtown. Maybe eliminating that and sharing the wealth with the entire city will not only keep businesses but will draw new ones instead of seeing empty ones all over the place. 

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23 hours ago, Brucesky02 said:

Let me be clear - I'm not trying to reinstate the previous topic used for discussing Fargo. This is not for discussing crime - just for business topics, like the Grand Forks one.

 

Anecdotally, it seems like Fargo is in a bit of a downturn. When I lived there, (2014-2016) I was worried about what I perceived as over-building in housing (especially in high end homes) and over-expansion of businesses. My feeling had been that the growth in restaurants/retail was being propped up by temporary demand increases due to the over-construction going on in the housing and retail markets. Once housing slowed, my thought had been the construction workforce would drop and demand for hotels/restaurants/retail along with that.

I've been seeing a number of articles about places closing and the housing market stagnating. Anyone have anything else that's out there with analysis on all this? I haven't been able to find any concrete housing numbers to look at other than the first article below. What other factors do you think are at play here? Oil?

Some examples of what I'm referencing:
http://www.inforum.com/news/4171949-many-unsold-homes-f-m-area-could-have-do-uncertainty-years-election
http://www.inforum.com/business/4101728-alerus-close-two-branches
http://www.inforum.com/business/4175317-moorhead-hotel-owner-says-construction-blame-recent-closure
http://www.inforum.com/variety/4084144-downtown-concert-venue-new-direction-close-fall
http://www.inforum.com/news/4009176-west-fargo-business-close-laying-dozens-employees
http://www.inforum.com/business/3948419-uptown-gallery-closing-after-deal-falls-through
https://www.wday.com/business/4192601-sears-store-west-acres-close-doors
https://www.wday.com/business/4118526-moorhead-kmart-close-years-end
http://www.inforum.com/business/4194143-fargos-lone-star-steakhouse-closes-after-23-years-business
http://www.inforum.com/business/4135338-fargos-coldwell-banker-first-realty-closing-friday
http://www.inforum.com/business/4116155-junk-giant-closing-downtown-fargo-owners-focus-vinyl-giant
http://www.inforum.com/business/3950180-grazies-italian-restaurant-close-saturday

 

From memory, you can also put in the recent RIP list:
-King Leo's
-TGI Fridays
-Quaker Steak
-Ole & Lena's Pizza (mall location)

I won't speculate on every article on your list, but a lot of those closings were because places weren't worth keeping open.  Examples: the Moorhead Days Inn.  Place was a dump and had been without it's liquor license for some time.  The road construction may have been the final dagger, but it hadn't been a good place in a decade.  Quaker Steak was terrible food, with terrible service, in a high rent area.  I've never been so disappointed to learn a chain was coming to town, and they lived down to the reputation in every way.  Sears and Kmart are as much victims of their corporate headquarters as anything else.  And I could continue to go on one-by-one.  Many closings are actually for good reason (and sometimes good riddance!).  On the flip side, the south side of the metro continues to open new businesses as a high rate.  Just going down Veterns' Boulevard gives you Tru Blu (opening this spring), and just announced addition to the new hotel behind Blarney Stone, new hotel by Cost-co, restaurants like Blvd. and Brutus Brickhouse, a new brewery in Flatland Brewing, and numerous other buildings going up and businesses opening.  Last time I was in south Moorhead I was surprised by the new Hornbachers and other construction on 8th St.  Fargo's 52nd Ave is picking up with lots of new business (and have you seen all the building out by Davies HS?) and a proposed outlet mall now on the table.

I think the area will continue to expand for some time to come.  The diversion plan will potentially draw a boundary to expansion to the southwest, but that will take some time if it happens at all.  Even then, that would potentially (likely?) cause property values to rise, as there's less area to spread into.

 

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Fargo is just seeing a slight downturn in the economy, which hurts marginal businesses the most.  A shakeout always occurs with any economic cycle.  The stronger businesses survive.

Since the 60's, Fargo has enjoyed sucking the life out of small town businesses, and more recently from other regional ND cities. That kind of economic transfer won't stop.  Bismarck and Fargo have become the predominant destinations for retail and services and it will only get more pronounced barring some unique happening - like Williston coming into prominence with a Bakken II boom or Grand Forks getting thousands of jobs from the UAV industry.

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Since FedEx moved to Fargo my paycheck has been late every pay day.  Some of it has been mountain air has had mx issues recently but the flight from Fargo never gets in before 1030 now when it was grand forks it was always on the ground by 9. 

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8 minutes ago, Vegas_Sioux said:

Since FedEx moved to Fargo my paycheck has been late every pay day.  Some of it has been mountain air has had mx issues recently but the flight from Fargo never gets in before 1030 now when it was grand forks it was always on the ground by 9. 

Has FedEx not heard of direct deposit? Sounds like they still send it on a Wells Fargo wagon!

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6 minutes ago, siouxkid12 said:

Has FedEx not heard of direct deposit? Sounds like they still send it on a Wells Fargo wagon!

I'm delta my pay stub comes on he FedEx flight. I do have direct deposit but it's due by 1030 on pay day. Hasn't happened since the move. 

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1 hour ago, NoiseInsideMyHead said:

I was surprised to read that Simply Mac closed. Did they relocate, or are they Simply toast?

Bigger question...when will Fargo get a real Apple store?

We have these......

Cover.gif

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1 hour ago, UNDBIZ said:

http://www.inforum.com/business/4227287-bostons-restaurant-sports-bar-open-first-north-dakota-location-west-fargo

Boston's restaurant to open in West Fargo.

Wasn't there a Boston's in Grand Forks 10 or so years ago?  Next to Texas Roadhouse.

I think you're correct. It was later turned into a Space Aliens. I think the West Fargo Boston's might be across the street from Blarney Stone next to the Element hotel.  I noticed construction there that is looking similar to the one that was in Grand Forks.

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13 hours ago, Prison_Mike said:

I think you're correct. It was later turned into a Space Aliens. I think the West Fargo Boston's might be across the street from Blarney Stone next to the Element hotel.  I noticed construction there that is looking similar to the one that was in Grand Forks.

That's supposed to be True Blue Social Club, or some variation of spelling on that.  Owned by the people who own Lucky's 13.

Not sure where Boston's will go, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's on Veterans' and viewable from Scheel's Arena.

Boston's is usually like a classier Wild Wings, but more focused on pizza than wings.

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We finally find out what's going in the King Leo's building, and it's just another quick-serve pizza chain.  I've never had Blaze pizza, but it's still just pizza.

http://www.inforum.com/business/4227886-pizza-chain-open-soon-former-fargo-king-leos-restaurant

They're right that it should be a good location with the mall traffic, but it's also only a few blocks from Uncle Maddio's, which is basically the same concept (corner of 15th and 42nd for Blaze, vs 17th and 45th for Maddios).

 

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2 hours ago, siouxforcefans said:

We finally find out what's going in the King Leo's building, and it's just another quick-serve pizza chain.  I've never had Blaze pizza, but it's still just pizza.

http://www.inforum.com/business/4227886-pizza-chain-open-soon-former-fargo-king-leos-restaurant

They're right that it should be a good location with the mall traffic, but it's also only a few blocks from Uncle Maddio's, which is basically the same concept (corner of 15th and 42nd for Blaze, vs 17th and 45th for Maddios).

 

They better plan on a delivery only as that building is very small. 

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